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Topics - Dark Squiggle

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Fantasy Book & Author Discussion / Discussion of R. A. Heinlein
« on: March 29, 2018, 05:08:41 PM »
I've been reading some Heinlein, and wanted to discuss his work. So far I've read Time enough for Love, and 1/2 each of To sail Beyond the Sunset and Stranger in a strange Land, but the main point is Heinlein, not the individual books, and I'm not scared of spoilers. Feel free to add your own topics, but here are some to start with.

I think Lazarus Long has a lot in common with Jean Valjean (Les Miserables, Victor Hugo), as both are:
1) Long-lived, incredibly powerful, benign, help out the other characters,
2)More angelic as time goes on.
3)Never have a relationship of any sort with someone they consider an equal.
4)Are very loving and loved, but don't love themselves.
5)Never have a anything in any way similar to a marriage, even pushing sex away when it is shoved on their laps.
6)Live by some strange, self-made "unbreakable" code.
7)Attempt suicide. J. Valjean successfully, L. Long unsuccessfully, when they feel their job in life is finished.

I feel that Heinlein is a rather entrenched misogynist, in spite of his constant Feminist talk, because:
1) His 'leader' characters always seem to be male, even when there are women under them who completely outgun them.
2)Any time he has characters have an important conversation, unless it is between sexual partners, all the women suddenly disappear.
3)His flagship (not the main character, but the 'smart' and 'competent' one, I don't know the word for it.) character is always a very sexist male, and excuses himself by coming from the "Bible Belt" as if that somehow changes things.
4) His women are all wanting to do things for the men they like all the time.

I find that his books seem to devolve into a string of sexual encounters at some point. Is trying to impress his audience by how open he is?

If his idea of sex is "getting closer" (his words), why do almost all of his characters have sex with strangers and then forget about them?

Why are all his AI computers female? And why do they all (except Dora, who is eternally 9 years old) want to be human?

Why do all of his characters want to have sex with their very close relatives?

Why, if they are so loose with sex, are none of his characters gay or lesbian?

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[NOV 2017] Water / How do you see the stories?
« on: November 20, 2017, 12:05:07 AM »
How do you see the stories?

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Hi. I actually joined this forum so I could have somewhere to post this thread. Hello Everyone  ;)
At the end of the book, Sioned, the main character, has her husband (maybe he's the main character, I'm not sure),  kidnapped by Ianthe, the bad guy, so that Ianthe can have a the kid with him that she's wanted, both to obtain an heir to his lands and to insult the Sioned in return for some stupid grudge. Sioned being a witch, she tries to save her husband, but is captured by the guards in spite of her magic. She is then robbed of her wedding ring (part of the grudge), held in the dungeon and raped by the bad guy's men until Ianthe decides she is pregnant and lets the Sioned and her husband go. Sioned, being infertile and wanting a kid, waits until Ianthe gives birth, then comes back, kills her, and takes the child Ianthe had with her husband as her own.
Okay, I know  some cichlids will kill each other and then care for the orphaned fry, but this is going too far. Too kill your enemy for doing something like that fine - but to kill her and steal her baby to raise as your own? How can you be the good guy after that? She'd have to say "Yeah son, I need to tell you I'm not your  mother - I killed her so I could steal you" at some point, and become instantly evil, right? Imagine if your mother did such a thing.
Overall, I liked the book even if all the marriages are held together by some kind of magic that really doesn't exist in the real world (it is fantasy), and the characters spend so much time dealing with sex & dominance that you'd think they were cichlid fish, not people.

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