Fantasy Faction

Fantasy Faction Writers => Monthly Writing Contest => Topic started by: xiagan on September 20, 2016, 01:09:22 PM

Title: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 20, 2016, 01:09:22 PM
Hey all,

@tebakutis (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=31262) approached me with some thoughts about the contest.

One thing I have noticed (and in some cases, people have actually asked about on voting threads) is that, because we have some very talented writers as regulars, we already have some cases where people have won the contest multiple times. My concern with this is that people who notice this trend, consciously or unconsciously, might be discouraged from writing a story or entering because they think "Oh, so-and-so is just going to win again". I worry new people might become intimidated if we have too many regulars, who are also talented writers, piling up multiple wins.

So! My suggestion would be a simple rules update: basically, when someone "wins" the contest, they become ineligible to win the next two contests. They are still absolutely welcome to submit a story [...] but these stories would not be an option in the voting thread [they would be a bonus]. Only [stories submitted by] authors who hadn't won in the past two months would be eligible for voting.

I think this would do a couple of things. People who do the contest mainly because they simply love writing could always submit, even if they won previously - and to make this more palatable, getting pitched as a "bonus" story is a nice way to congratulate them again for winning the prior month. However, this would also "open up the field" a bit and (hopefully) encourage folks who might not be fully confident in their own writing to take a shot. I'm thinking a case like "Hey, Rukaio_Alter" won last month, and he's off the ballot for two months, so I'm totally going to write that humor story I've always wanted to write and submit!

The reason I suggest a two month cooldown for the winner, instead of a one month, is to further spread the thrill of winning around to more writers. As an example, let's say Jmack last month's contest (potions!) and Lanko wins this month's (pirates!). That would mean both Jmack and Lanko would be out for the next one, hopefully giving another new writer [...] additional incentive to submit.

I agree that this may motivate writers who haven't won a contest yet but I'm not sure if it would demotivate those of you who did.
Since I'm a fan of democratic processes, it's a poll again! :D

Note: The poll is only to get a general picture of your opinions. Since everybody (even people who don't write, read or vote in the contests) can vote, I'm giving more weight to the discussion below.

Thank you, Eric, for thinking about ways to improve the contests and for participating in them! :)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Eclipse on September 20, 2016, 01:22:46 PM
I voted no
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 20, 2016, 01:27:33 PM
We haven't won a contest, and while the idea does have some merit I think it'd be a negative overall for us. Then again, I'm always in favour of fair and equal competition, and anything involving handicaps automatically makes me less interested.

The only potential unfair advantage that could possibly exist in the contest as is would be people voting for the writer rather than the story, and to be honest I highly doubt that happens at all (incidentally, still think it'd be cool to have all stories anonymous for a month to see how that feels).

Keep it as is for me!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 20, 2016, 01:30:33 PM
Forgot to mention that the last five contests were won by two users.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Eclipse on September 20, 2016, 01:36:23 PM
Still no, the other writers should just see it as an extra challenge plus when there do win it be more satisfying.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 20, 2016, 01:48:16 PM
Yeah doesn't change anything for me.

What percentage of regulars have won at least one contest? Pretty sure it's rather high!

Edit: according to this thread (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/monthly-writing-contest/winners-and-stories/) and this thread (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/monthly-writing-contest/titles-for-regulars/), it breaks down as follows:

Number of regulars: 25
Number of regulars who have won: 13

So roughly half.  :)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Peat on September 20, 2016, 02:09:04 PM
Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: night_wrtr on September 20, 2016, 02:10:27 PM
Interesting idea, but I lean toward Eclipse in that it makes me want to try all the more to beat someone who may be a regular winner. If I were to win a contest(  ;D haha... :'( ) in which someone was not allowed to win, I would have mixed feelings because I would wonder if I really would have won had that person's story been in the running.

I would rather let them enter to challenge us all to grow as writers. It forces us to give it our all. The contest is full of so many talented folks and I give credit to them all for helping me to get better.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: night_wrtr on September 20, 2016, 02:12:53 PM
Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.

Agreed, and this is part of the reason why m3m is a rockstar and makes a version of the kindle e-reader with titles only so that you can't tell who submitted each story.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Eclipse on September 20, 2016, 02:14:30 PM
Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.

It be fun but we would all know Arcane and Nora entries ;-)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 20, 2016, 03:23:44 PM
Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.

It be fun but we would all know Arcane and Nora entries ;-)

Whoa. I don't know if I should feel honored or offended. I mean... I'm flattered to have a recognizable voice, but I somehow have the feeling that this is a simpler reference to Jmack's quote signature?

 ;D

Anyway, I voted no.

Not because I don't find regulars over-winning frustrating, but because I think it'd be utterly unfair, and not a rule you'd find in any other larger tournament.
Competitions out there with prize money and publications tend to prevent you from submitting if you're too famous. So if we wanted to keep this amateur only, we could request that people don't enter if they have had enough serious pubs and maybe have a book published conventionally.
But then, ours was never an amateur contest but a community one. So why change that?

Besides, I think we have the same people being voted for because their style and story appeals more to some, in a small community of voters. The more newbies arrive, the more tastes we'll have, the fairer the judgement. It's a matter of making ourselves bigger, not more restricted!

In the end, if a story wins by a pure landslide, because they were clearly the best plot, best prose, best whatever, and everyone clearly thought it was worth voting for, you'll give the prize to the person next in line, and X many votes short, for the sake of giving mental cookies?
If I were awarded best story in the shadow of a previous month winner incapacitated, I'd feel bad and probably feel no great sense of achievement. I don't want to be cheated from my wins, nor anyone else, even if it means never getting any wins at all.
Last I checked, the publishing world was a savage, depressing jungle. We can't be handing out participation prizes, we're a small community. You get the chance to have your story criticised and read and peer reviewed, you get to learn by seeing how others handled the same topic, etc.
 
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 20, 2016, 03:41:39 PM
Besides, I think we have the same people being voted for because their style and story appeals more to some, in a small community of voters. The more newbies arrive, the more tastes we'll have, the fairer the judgement. It's a matter of making ourselves bigger, not more restricted!

so totally this!  we're inclusive around here, not exclusive.


personally, this is what i think about the options here:

1) we leave it the same -- voting feels sort of self-correcting with multiple winners.  i don't know for a fact, of course, but i would guess that voters are like "oh, they've already won a couple months now so, even tho i would totally vote for them, i'm going to vote for other people."

i can't predict the future, but i would hazard a guess that it'll be a while before tebakutis wins another.  just like jmack and rukaio haven't won another.

but, from a voter standpoint, it sure would be nice if there was no mental overhead to voting for stories based on fairness.  (because we LOVE all our writers!  not just the 'usual suspects' and want to see the succeed!)  we could just pick the ones we liked.


2) we don't let the winners participate -- this totally disincentivizes our best writers to participate or write quality stories.  if they aren't on the voting page, their stories won't be in the official annals of the contest, they might as well just post them to the critiques section of the site.

or, just not write them at all.

which, of course, will kill entry inertia which will hamper the contest over time -- especially if you acknowledge that we're basically saying, at two months penalty, "each contest will have two fewer entrants".

i predict eventually dwindling to zero entries.

also, what if we try it, and it turns out we hate it?  what happens to the stories we'll have missed out on?  what if a winner would have gone two or three in a row, but doesn't because rules?


3) we do everything anonymously -- sure, there are a few writers that have a strong, consistent voice and are pretty recognizable, but that's part of the fun.  i love reading the "no authors" version of the ebooks BECAUSE i like to guess at who wrote which.  (even tho my success rate is probably a miserable 1-in-5)

to me, this is the most interesting one.  especially now that we have the mechanism (the anonymous user) to support it.  tho, selfishly speaking, it'd mess up my automated ebook thing by making everything anonymous and making me want to re-generate the books with the correct names.

also, it's interesting because it's pretty easy to test in isolation -- just for a month -- unlike the other options, which take a few months to see how they shake out.

and, a BONUS THOUGHT!
4) eligible for voting, just not winning -- so, what if we kept all the entries, everyone could vote for whatever they wanted, but we just ignore the previous month's winner if they're in the first spot?

this has a couple effects:  a) it allows the top-vote-getter inner kudos even if they don't technically get the win and b) doesn't artificially inflate "down ballot" stories because our voting biases typically take a vote away from a popular writer and give it to a story we don't technically like more.

BONUS THOUGHT TWO!!
5) incentivizing the rest of the board to vote -- what if we offered coins to voters?  what if we bumped the member's post count for voting?  what if, for every contest you voted in, you were entered in a drawing for a book to be given away once a quarter?

even crazier?  what if all of that happened only if you picked the winner?

game theory insanity!

anyway . . .

for me?  none of the above really matters.  i look at the contest differently than lots of our writers, i'd bet.  i like the fun, the camaraderie, and especially the practice.  looking back over the past 18 months (the time it's been since i decided i was going to give this writer thing a legit try) and my writing has improved dramatically.  i've learned so very much and it's been almost exclusively due to the writing contest, the writing groups, and the rest of you writerly people.

however, this is my favorite place on the internet ever -- and i've been on the internet since 1992, back before the www and we were all about gopher and bbs -- so, i don't want any permanent changes messing things up permanently.  (tho, i honestly don't see that happening)

that being said, i love trying new things.  let's try something new and fun!  let's see what happens!

this could be exciting!


edit:  bonus thought three!  what if we enabled the facebook group to vote in the contest?
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: ArcaneArtsVelho on September 20, 2016, 03:45:09 PM
I think that such a rule would demean the value of a win. (Even more so if there was a bonus entry that was clearly way better than the winning entry.) So, a firm 'no' from me.


Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.

It be fun but we would all know Arcane and Nora entries ;-)
Please tell me what gives my stories away, so I can change it.  :)
(Unless it's because I'm almost always last or second to last to submit, in which case I'm probably not going to change it.  ;D )
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: ScarletBea on September 20, 2016, 04:10:23 PM
When I first heard about this I thought it might be a good idea, but after reading all your comments, I don't like it anymore, hehe
(sorry Eric!)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: tebakutis on September 20, 2016, 04:20:30 PM
When I first heard about this I thought it might be a good idea, but after reading all your comments, I don't like it anymore, hehe
(sorry Eric!)

Haha, no worries! Obviously, my concerns were unfounded. :0
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 20, 2016, 04:24:28 PM
Quote
4) eligible for voting, just not winning -- so, what if we kept all the entries, everyone could vote for whatever they wanted, but we just ignore the previous month's winner if they're in the first spot?

this has a couple effects:  a) it allows the top-vote-getter inner kudos even if they don't technically get the win and b) doesn't artificially inflate "down ballot" stories because our voting biases typically take a vote away from a popular writer and give it to a story we don't technically like more.

That's what I thought would be implemented, and what I said I'd dislike. If I saw myself winning a contest because the guy/gal with most votes gets recognized but had already won, I'd feel like a placeholder and be disappointed with my win. It'd be worst because I'd KNOW that I'm not the favourite story.

Quote
5) incentivizing the rest of the board to vote -- what if we offered coins to voters?  what if we bumped the member's post count for voting?  what if, for every contest you voted in, you were entered in a drawing for a book to be given away once a quarter?

even crazier?  what if all of that happened only if you picked the winner?

game theory insanity!
This is a much better idea, IMO, just not the part about getting bonuses only if you get the winner. Because then people would be pushed to try and think "what the others will like", rather than "what I like", however unpopular it might be. A simple incentive to vote could do good though!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Eclipse on September 20, 2016, 04:38:20 PM
I think that such a rule would demean the value of a win. (Even more so if there was a bonus entry that was clearly way better than the winning entry.) So, a firm 'no' from me.


Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.

It be fun but we would all know Arcane and Nora entries ;-)
Please tell me what gives my stories away, so I can change it.  :)
(Unless it's because I'm almost always last or second to last to submit, in which case I'm probably not going to change it.  ;D )

My comments were lighthearted and not to offend either of you

I can tell Nora's because it be one of the darkest tale amongst all the light ones, a gem of darkness also if it got a flesh eater that just confirms it :-)

I think I might have mistaken you for someone else there's a writer here who did a lot of great comedic tales amongst more of the serious themes.

Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: ArcaneArtsVelho on September 20, 2016, 05:04:37 PM
I think I might have mistaken you for someone else there's a writer here who did a lot of great comedic tales amongst more of the serious themes.
Certainly not me then.  ;) ;D

But seriously, I did suspect that you might have meant Rukaio; after all, his RPG character was called Arcane.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Peat on September 20, 2016, 05:20:43 PM
In fairness, just because most of the regulars want to swing at the best, doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

For me... well, I don't enter the contests. I keep meaning to but 1500 words is too much for me unless I really love the idea. But when I enter, its to enjoy writing and learn what I can afterwards. I love winning, but that's secondary, and only means something if I'm beating the best.

Incentives for competing and voting could be an idea. I like that one.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 20, 2016, 05:29:24 PM
Quote
4) eligible for voting, just not winning -- so, what if we kept all the entries, everyone could vote for whatever they wanted, but we just ignore the previous month's winner if they're in the first spot?

this has a couple effects:  a) it allows the top-vote-getter inner kudos even if they don't technically get the win and b) doesn't artificially inflate "down ballot" stories because our voting biases typically take a vote away from a popular writer and give it to a story we don't technically like more.

That's what I thought would be implemented, and what I said I'd dislike. If I saw myself winning a contest because the guy/gal with most votes gets recognized but had already won, I'd feel like a placeholder and be disappointed with my win. It'd be worst because I'd KNOW that I'm not the favourite story.

yeah.  the initial proposal was skipping the voting step altogether for winners.

and, i'm with you for this one making me sad if i "won".  in fact, i almost called it the "pity winner" option.  heh.


Quote
5) incentivizing the rest of the board to vote -- what if we offered coins to voters?  what if we bumped the member's post count for voting?  what if, for every contest you voted in, you were entered in a drawing for a book to be given away once a quarter?

even crazier?  what if all of that happened only if you picked the winner?

game theory insanity!
This is a much better idea, IMO, just not the part about getting bonuses only if you get the winner. Because then people would be pushed to try and think "what the others will like", rather than "what I like", however unpopular it might be. A simple incentive to vote could do good though!

right?!  wouldn't that be fun?

i don't think we want to decouple "incentive" from "only if you pick the winner" tho.  otherwise, folks will just swing by, vote for the first three in the list without reading anything, and collect their payment.

but, you hit the nail on the head as to why i added the winner-picking option.  we're such a diverse group of tastes, that it substantially flattens our votes.  voting for something that is "the most mainstream" would probably consolidate them a bunch more.

that being said, it would also disincentivize some of the cooler poems and experimental stuff we do.

*shrug*

maybe that's the added twist on each contest we're looking for -- a second-order property:  the currently implemented topic AND the addition of audience.

again, like an all-anonymous month, that's something we can just try out for fun one month.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: tebakutis on September 20, 2016, 06:01:27 PM
In fairness, just because most of the regulars want to swing at the best, doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

For me... well, I don't enter the contests. I keep meaning to but 1500 words is too much for me unless I really love the idea. But when I enter, its to enjoy writing and learn what I can afterwards. I love winning, but that's secondary, and only means something if I'm beating the best.

Well, I thought it might be an issue, but given what most everyone is saying, it doesn't seem to be. :)

To give some background, I started thinking about this a few months back, when a couple of new entrants to the contest expressed some trepidation about entering. I want to say it was when we were jokingly throwing around the "God Emperor of the Writing Contest" title, but I think it was also a case where some new posters specifically asked about how often new people win, because we'd done some math about multiple winners.

Personally, I don't think there's any bias toward regulars (I always vote for what I feel are the best stories, despite how difficult you awesome authors make it to decide, and I feel like pretty much all of you do the same) but I was more worried about the *appearance* of an advantage. As everyone knows, sometimes you don't actually need to have a problem ... you just need to suggest that there might be a problem, and people will react accordingly. However, judging from the points everyone has made on this thread, it seems like putting a "cooldown" on winning would do more harm than good.

I think the best solution is to just take every opportunity we can to encourage newbies to enter again (I usually try to drop the authors of the stories I vote for a PM, to let them know how much I enjoyed what they wrote) and just nip those worries in the bud whenever they come up.

Also, as I told Xiagan, I think our monthly contests are about my favorite thing ever. I have written *so* many stories I would never have written as a result of our themes (really? A pirate story?) and as flattering as it is the times I have won (thank you!) just the process itself feels like its own reward.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 20, 2016, 06:24:55 PM
Also, as I told Xiagan, I think our monthly contests are about my favorite thing ever. I have written *so* many stories I would never have written as a result of our themes (really? A pirate story?) and as flattering as it is the times I have won (thank you!) just the process itself feels like its own reward.

this cannot be overstated.

themes outside your comfort zone, regimented monthly practice, visibility into other interpretations, a safe place to stretch techniques, social proof to keep you powering on -- if you're a writer on these forums and not submitting entries (*cough* peat *cough*), you're missing out on some amazing development.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Lanko on September 20, 2016, 08:00:17 PM
Nah.

Although it would be intriguing to see if there was any change if every story was posted anonymously.

Agreed, and this is part of the reason why m3m is a rockstar and makes a version of the kindle e-reader with titles only so that you can't tell who submitted each story.

Haha, I also get this version. Sometimes it's not surprising to see who wrote the ones I voted for, but sometimes it's a total surprise.

Also, as I told Xiagan, I think our monthly contests are about my favorite thing ever. I have written *so* many stories I would never have written as a result of our themes (really? A pirate story?) and as flattering as it is the times I have won (thank you!) just the process itself feels like its own reward.

this cannot be overstated.

themes outside your comfort zone, regimented monthly practice, visibility into other interpretations, a safe place to stretch techniques, social proof to keep you powering on -- if you're a writer on these forums and not submitting entries (*cough* peat and Raptori *cough*), you're missing out on some amazing development.

Edited.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 20, 2016, 09:01:44 PM
Haha, I also get this version. Sometimes it's not surprising to see who wrote the ones I voted for, but sometimes it's a total surprise.
Only minor niggle with the ebooks is that formatting often doesn't get transferred. Minor thing really, but it can have a noticeable effect if you notice details a lot!

Also, as I told Xiagan, I think our monthly contests are about my favorite thing ever. I have written *so* many stories I would never have written as a result of our themes (really? A pirate story?) and as flattering as it is the times I have won (thank you!) just the process itself feels like its own reward.

this cannot be overstated.

themes outside your comfort zone, regimented monthly practice, visibility into other interpretations, a safe place to stretch techniques, social proof to keep you powering on -- if you're a writer on these forums and not submitting entries (*cough* peat and Raptori *cough*), you're missing out on some amazing development.

Edited.
::)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Lanko on September 20, 2016, 09:28:55 PM
Haha, I also get this version. Sometimes it's not surprising to see who wrote the ones I voted for, but sometimes it's a total surprise.
Only minor niggle with the ebooks is that formatting often doesn't get transferred. Minor thing really, but it can have a noticeable effect if you notice details a lot!

Yes, you have to format again using the forum tools. That happened in some of my earlier entries...actually, it happened in the Conan story too... I forgot to format again a phrase in German to italics...

Another problem I couldn't solve is when I wanted to jump a paragraph to show passage of time or a switch in POV. I ended up using an asterisk to do it, but now that I think about it, I wonder if jumping two paragraphs would have that effect when converted to e-book.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 20, 2016, 10:44:09 PM
In fairness, just because most of the regulars want to swing at the best, doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

For me... well, I don't enter the contests. I keep meaning to but 1500 words is too much for me unless I really love the idea. But when I enter, its to enjoy writing and learn what I can afterwards. I love winning, but that's secondary, and only means something if I'm beating the best.

Incentives for competing and voting could be an idea. I like that one.

Peat, you do realise that the contest is 500 prose words minimum right? So you can totally submit 600 words if that's good enough for you!

M3m, how about participating as an incentive? Because shame and social pressure sorts of insure that writers vote. It'd avoid random voting (though would our sweet members be such jackasses as that??)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 20, 2016, 11:56:57 PM
M3m, how about participating as an incentive? Because shame and social pressure sorts of insure that writers vote. It'd avoid random voting (though would our sweet members be such jackasses as that??)

oh, for sure.  if folks write stories, i'm sure they've got enough equity in the contest that they'll vote to the best of their abilities.  there's a bit of reciprocity there, too, right?  "i'm going to spend the time to consider your story in-full.  i expect you to do the same for mine."

and reading-only members don't necessarily need to be jackasses to shortcut a vote.  there are often a ton of words to read and, i'm sure our members are busy, and i'm sure someone somewhere might just skim and vote by titles or some such.  not purposefully messing with the results, but not caring enough since they don't have a vested interest in correctly uncovering a winner.  so, not purposely careless.  just not as thorough.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Peat on September 21, 2016, 06:35:47 AM
Also, as I told Xiagan, I think our monthly contests are about my favorite thing ever. I have written *so* many stories I would never have written as a result of our themes (really? A pirate story?) and as flattering as it is the times I have won (thank you!) just the process itself feels like its own reward.

this cannot be overstated.

themes outside your comfort zone, regimented monthly practice, visibility into other interpretations, a safe place to stretch techniques, social proof to keep you powering on -- if you're a writer on these forums and not submitting entries (*cough* peat *cough*), you're missing out on some amazing development.

Alas, shameless hussie that I am, I'm not missing out as I do this on other forums. Just they offer micro-fiction which is easier to fit into the schedule.

Nora - I know. My mind's just automatically set to use the maximum. I can't think of stories that I'd want to tell in 600 if I have 1500.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 21, 2016, 12:19:40 PM
Well, that's a clear result...
I think Eric is right in that we have to address concerns like this:
So two people basically rotate winning this contest?  Think I'll be passing on this event in the future.
when they arise in a serious manner.

If some kind of dinosaur or somebody else has the time it would be interesting to see how many entries participants needed for their first win... :)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 01:10:03 PM
If some kind of dinosaur or somebody else has the time it would be interesting to see how many entries participants needed for their first win... :)
(http://www.picgifs.com/smileys/smileys-and-emoticons/whistling/smileys-whistling-823718.gif)

I'll see what I can do!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: DaveEllis on September 21, 2016, 02:04:18 PM
I'm new to the site, and am considering taking part in the contest going forward as a way of kickstarting my writing.  I wouldn't be put off entering if the same few kept winning, but I wouldn't expect to have a chance of winning. 

I would prefer an anonymous posting, for instance one of the moderators posting all the stories as they receive them, to give a little more fairness to the comp, as it prevents voting for the name rather than the story.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 02:22:23 PM
I would prefer an anonymous posting, for instance one of the moderators posting all the stories as they receive them, to give a little more fairness to the comp, as it prevents voting for the name rather than the story.
This would also prevent people from deciding not to vote for someone because they've won it several times recently (which is a good thing imo). Not sure if people actually do that, but someone (m3m?) mentioned it above. Only way to find out how it would affect the votes is to give it a go!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 21, 2016, 02:43:39 PM
I got it. We're trying this next month!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: night_wrtr on September 21, 2016, 02:45:13 PM
I like the anonymous posting idea.

EDIT: also, should all the stories be posted all at once when the submissions are final?
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 21, 2016, 03:11:29 PM
I dislike the anonymous posting idea because it'll basically kill off the discussion thread entirely, as if people say "yay, finally posted!!" You'll know it's them.
It also means I can't re read and edit my own story once it's submitted without sending X many emails to the moderator in charge.
It also means we can't talk about the ideas we had or misgivings we encounter. Like "hey I've decided to write in present tense and this is bothering me, what do you think?" > only one present tense story means it's yours.
The critic thread is pretty dead too, so we'd never talk about our stories basically...

I think that implementing a forced review time for example, to make sure everyone gets a constructive critique, would be way more appealing (at least to me) than an anonymous thread.
I'll completely recognize Jmack, rukaio or m3m or tebakutis entries. I'll also enjoy working on the stories less if we can't talk about them. The liveliness of the discussion thread is the only thing that half convinces me to keep working on this month's idea.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 03:55:55 PM
Alrighty then. Hopefully I didn't screw the spreadsheet up, but I'm pretty sure these are accurate!

Important facts before we start: the total number of contests run so far is 65, and the total number of winning stories is 71 (due to tied months).

Entries before first win for all winners:

People who have won with their first entry account for 40% of all winning stories. Repeat victories only account for 31%, first-time winners 69%.

(http://i.imgur.com/wHwH6At.gif)


Regulars who have not yet won a contest:

Obviously there a huge number of contest entrants - 242 - but only 47 have entered 5 contests or more. Of those, only 14 have not yet won one (30%). They tend towards the lower number of total entries, with a couple of outliers. In other words, if you consistently enter the contest, your likelihood of having won one increases. Duh.  :P

(http://i.imgur.com/Uj3T06F.gif)


Total wins and total entries for contest winners:

At a glance, it looks like these stats show that the people with multiple contest wins have a) entered many times, and b) won within their first three or four entries, with one exception who won with their sixth entry. I'll let someone else work out if these have any more insight to give!

(http://i.imgur.com/oFG3uvN.gif)





I dislike the anonymous posting idea because it'll basically kill off the discussion thread entirely, as if people say "yay, finally posted!!" You'll know it's them.
People posting "yay, finally posted!!" isn't exactly a discussion though. There's arguably more to discuss if the identities are not known - who the author of each story is, which regulars have entered and which haven't, etc.

It also means I can't re read and edit my own story once it's submitted without sending X many emails to the moderator in charge.
It's not difficult to hold off on submitting until the final day or two, which would mean you'd have just as much time to get edits in.

It also means we can't talk about the ideas we had or misgivings we encounter. Like "hey I've decided to write in present tense and this is bothering me, what do you think?" > only one present tense story means it's yours.
Depends on what's being discussed. In that example, you could easily say "I'm thinking about writing in present tense, what do you guys think of it", which leaves it unclear as to whether or not you'll actually do so in the end. Just requires a bit of thought about what others will understand from your comments.
 
The critic thread is pretty dead too, so we'd never talk about our stories basically...
Nothing stopping everyone discussing which entry was written by whom after the fact, which could actually be a pretty interesting discussion, especially if people note down who they originally thought each story was written by.

I think that implementing a forced review time for example, to make sure everyone gets a constructive critique, would be way more appealing (at least to me) than an anonymous thread.
As in people would be forced to critique others work? Doesn't sound good to me. If people are interested in critiquing, there's already a thread for that. If it's mostly empty, then it means people aren't interested, so forcing them to critique means you're forcing them to do something they don't want to do. Don't see how that could be anything but an awful idea!

I'll completely recognize Jmack, rukaio or m3m or tebakutis entries. I'll also enjoy working on the stories less if we can't talk about them. The liveliness of the discussion thread is the only thing that half convinces to keep working on this month's idea.
People rarely give away everything about their story while discussing it though, so it's a matter of keeping things more vague rather than not discussing at all!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 21, 2016, 03:58:08 PM
I would prefer an anonymous posting, for instance one of the moderators posting all the stories as they receive them, to give a little more fairness to the comp, as it prevents voting for the name rather than the story.
This would also prevent people from deciding not to vote for someone because they've won it several times recently (which is a good thing imo). Not sure if people actually do that, but someone (m3m?) mentioned it above. Only way to find out how it would affect the votes is to give it a go!

yup.  that was me.

mostly, i was channeling my inner dialog over the last year when i would read jmack, tebakutis, or rukaio stories.  i'm like, "dammit.  that's in my top tier.  stop writing such good stories so i can vote for someone else!"


I dislike the anonymous posting idea because it'll basically kill off the discussion thread entirely, as if people say "yay, finally posted!!" You'll know it's them.
It also means I can't re read and edit my own story once it's submitted without sending X many emails to the moderator in charge.

ooooh.  good point.  i hadn't thought of that.

tho, @night_wrtr (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=40254) has a good point in that they need to be posted at once anyway -- i think that fixes those issues.

i suspect we'll only do this for one month once @xiagan (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1148) comes to grips with how much work it is to post and edit 15 stories.


It also means we can't talk about the ideas we had or misgivings we encounter. Like "hey I've decided to write in present tense and this is bothering me, what do you think?" > only one present tense story means it's yours.

meh.  i think that's okay.

if someone REALLY wants to put the sleuthing in, they can totally figure it out regardless.  there are online tools that recognize author prose.  (the google keyword is "stylometry")


The critic thread is pretty dead too, so we'd never talk about our stories basically...

I think that implementing a forced review time for example, to make sure everyone gets a constructive critique, would be way more appealing (at least to me) than an anonymous thread.

this is a wholly different matter.

tho, forcing it?  erg.  i'd hate to do anything that kills off participation.  that strikes me as something that would.

makes me wonder, tho, if we as a group could figure out some low-friction tools to help with critiques.

one of my favorite short-but-sweet tools is one i learned from mary robinette kowal.  basically, just fill this in:
Quote
Regarding my story, tell me --
Something Awesome:


Something Boring:


Something Confusing:


Something Unbelievable:





I'll completely recognize Jmack, rukaio or m3m or tebakutis entries.

you won't recognize mine!  i'll just skip the image next month and fade into anonymity . . .

so, ha!  take that!

you don't know me.

i'm an ENIGMA!


I'll also enjoy working on the stories less if we can't talk about them. The liveliness of the discussion thread is the only thing that half convinces to keep working on this month's idea.

i disbelieve that any discussion thread you're a part of wouldn't be lively.

srsly, i think we've got this.  i'm hopeful that the anonymity will bring in more new writers and that will make up for any bumpy transition things.

but, yeah, we'll see.

at the very least, it's easy (for everyone but xia!) and worth a try.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: The Gem Cutter on September 21, 2016, 04:10:46 PM
@m3mnoch (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=40419)  I want to thank you - you're my filter. I just wait for your posts and /nod.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 21, 2016, 04:18:44 PM
That's the point. I won't be part of any discussion that completely and utterly prevents me from mentioning my story.
My "present tense" example was only an example. People asking "hey, is it fine to do space pirates?" is just another example. Who do we ask that if asking publicly cancels out the idea of anonymity?

All I'm saying is that I'm personally tittering on the edge of dropping the contests, because I haven't been very motivated recently, for various reasons, but I think that the impossibility to discuss anything but wide topics (aka be in another, more theme oriented Kings Paws?) is not going to help my motivation at all.
I like people knowing it's my work. Anonymity is cool when it comes down to choice...

What of people who sometimes re-use characters or older stories? Like Rukaio, or when I got Hades out of his box again? I write another Hades short story, and everyone will know it's mine.

I just don't understand why we want to go for another change, when we've very clearly voted in wide majority that we're happy with the contest as it is?
Maybe make a poll over anonymity if you want, but I'll vote no on that.

And yes m3m, I was thinking of similar mini reviews. Can't remember who was doing them for a while? Night? Having the option to write a couple of quick notes about what we like/dislike about each story would make mini reviews a thing, maybe? I mean, it's easier than having to re-read stories for the people who asked for reviews, when we're already busy writing the next month's short. But it should remain optional. I just think that if we try it out and like it, it could sort of install itself as well. If 10 people give you a short 2/3 lines critic, you'd feel like doing the same as you read through everything I'm sure.

Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: night_wrtr on September 21, 2016, 04:21:45 PM

It also means I can't re read and edit my own story once it's submitted without sending X many emails to the moderator in charge.
It's not difficult to hold off on submitting until the final day or two, which would mean you'd have just as much time to get edits in.


Yeah, I am terribly bad at posting my story as soon as I finish, then edit it every other day until the end. Nothing major, but a word here or there, misspellings, etc. But, I agree with Raptori that we could wait until its actually done, then submit it as the final version when the time comes.

Quote from: Raptori

The critic thread is pretty dead too, so we'd never talk about our stories basically...
Nothing stopping everyone discussing which entry was written by whom after the fact, which could actually be a pretty interesting discussion, especially if people note down who they originally thought each story was written by.

I think that implementing a forced review time for example, to make sure everyone gets a constructive critique, would be way more appealing (at least to me) than an anonymous thread.
As in people would be forced to critique others work? Doesn't sound good to me. If people are interested in critiquing, there's already a thread for that. If it's mostly empty, then it means people aren't interested, so forcing them to critique means you're forcing them to do something they don't want to do. Don't see how that could be anything but an awful idea!

this is a wholly different matter.

tho, forcing it?  erg.  i'd hate to do anything that kills off participation.  that strikes me as something that would.

makes me wonder, tho, if we as a group could figure out some low-friction tools to help with critiques.

one of my favorite short-but-sweet tools is one i learned from mary robinette kowal.  basically, just fill this in:
Quote
Regarding my story, tell me --
Something Awesome:


Something Boring:


Something Confusing:


Something Unbelievable:



I agree forcing a critique may drive people away, however a simple template like m3m posted might be easy enough for people to drop one or two sentences about it if they wanted. I also think that the critique thread would likely take off because we have been holding back our comments through the month. It would be a great time to engage in a conversation in more depth because at the point we have a critique thread, everyone has read each others stories and can actually provide some insights or convos. I know during the month when someone posts a comment about their story and things they have tried, I forget about the comment entirely by the time the story is read. Perhaps, maybe, possibly, we could have our own little Cambrian Explosion of critique/discussion threads.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 21, 2016, 04:32:11 PM
I also think that the critique thread would likely take off because we have been holding back our comments through the month. It would be a great time to engage in a conversation in more depth because at the point we have a critique thread, everyone has read each others stories and can actually provide some insights or convos. I know during the month when someone posts a comment about their story and things they have tried, I forget about the comment entirely by the time the story is read. Perhaps, maybe, possibly, we could have our own little Cambrian Explosion of critique/discussion threads.

I don't agree with that.

I tend to forget who wrote about what, mostly because I read as stories are published through the month if I'm done with mine early, and refresh my memory when doing the final read through for voting, but I usually vote early enough that by the time votes come out I've mostly forgotten people's work, and completely forgot what gripped me about it.
So doing a critique thread after would not help any more than it does now. What if story X was yours or someone else's? Cool. It's no motivation to go and re-read everything to link it to everyone, to be able to critique again. Critiquing post vote release has always been a process of re-reading the person's story for me. Anonymity would change nothing in that.

I re-read my story very often before posting, but posting formats the story differently and allows for better correction. I like being able to micro edit, and I always do it extensively if I post early enough.  :-\
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 04:41:35 PM
That's the point. I won't be part of any discussion that completely and utterly prevents me from mentioning my story.
My "present tense" example was only an example. People asking "hey, is it fine to do space pirates?" is just another example. Who do we ask that if asking publicly cancels out the idea of anonymity?
All I'm saying is that I'm personally tittering on the edge of dropping the contests, because I haven't been very motivated recently, for various reasons, but I think that the impossibility to discuss anything but wide topics (aka be in another, more theme oriented Kings Paws?) is not going to help my motivation at all.
I like people knowing it's my work. Anonymity is cool when it comes down to choice...

What of people who sometimes re-use characters or older stories? Like Rukaio, or when I got Hades out of his box again? I write another Hades short story, and everyone will know it's mine.
@m3mnoch (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=40419) has already answered that thoroughly imo!

I just don't understand why we want to go for another change, when we've very clearly voted in wide majority that we're happy with the contest as it is?
Maybe make a poll over anonymity if you want, but I'll vote no on that.
"I don't think winners should be barred from the contest" does not equal "I think the contest should remain exactly as it is". It's great as is, but that doesn't mean it's not worth trying an anonymous month to see if it makes it even better.

Another poll is definitely the best approach. I'd definitely vote yes!

And yes m3m, I was thinking of similar mini reviews. Can't remember who was doing them for a while? Night? Having the option to write a couple of quick notes about what we like/dislike about each story would make mini reviews a thing, maybe? I mean, it's easier than having to re-read stories for the people who asked for reviews, when we're already busy writing the next month's short. But it should remain optional. I just think that if we try it out and like it, it could sort of install itself as well. If 10 people give you a short 2/3 lines critic, you'd feel like doing the same as you read through everything I'm sure.
What's stopping you from doing mini-reviews right now? Waka did them for ages (at least I think it was waka), nothing to prevent others from doing the same.

I also think that the critique thread would likely take off because we have been holding back our comments through the month. It would be a great time to engage in a conversation in more depth because at the point we have a critique thread, everyone has read each others stories and can actually provide some insights or convos. I know during the month when someone posts a comment about their story and things they have tried, I forget about the comment entirely by the time the story is read. Perhaps, maybe, possibly, we could have our own little Cambrian Explosion of critique/discussion threads.

I don't agree with that.
We don't know whether it'll cause those things to happen because we haven't tried it out. You don't know either, it's all opinion. If it doesn't have a positive effect then at least we tried. It'd just be for one month.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 21, 2016, 04:47:55 PM
Nothing is stopping me to do mini reviews, and nothing is stopping anyone else. Yes, like I said, someone was doing them, and we could all try to do so.
I'm done voting this month and I already forgot most of the stories I voted on, so I'm not gonna do it. I have enough stuff to do irl at the moment, and I'm ages late in my critic group. No incentive really.

But we're discussing changes.
All I'm saying is that I'd rather have a change on the way we approach critic than on the way we post.

But yeah, I think we should poll this.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 04:57:54 PM
All I'm saying is that I'd rather have a change on the way we approach critic than on the way we post.
It'd be good, but are there any ways that could actually be done? Not sure changing the contest in any way would make it work without driving away people without the time or inclination to critique. Maybe if there were a couple of people who really wanted it to become a more common thing, and they did so every month, it'd encourage others to join in, but that feels like a long shot to me!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Eclipse on September 21, 2016, 05:31:46 PM
I think anonymous posting be fun to try out but  I don't  really think it matters, I always vote for the best stories not the authors and I don't think anyone here votes for who the authors are.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: ArcaneArtsVelho on September 21, 2016, 06:50:25 PM
[Sighs]

(http://i.imgur.com/Uj3T06F.gif)

That's strangely demoralising.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 06:54:45 PM
[Sighs]
(http://i.imgur.com/Uj3T06F.gif)
That's strangely demoralising.
Tell me about it.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 21, 2016, 07:08:24 PM
right?!

especially in contrast to how many folks win with their first entry.  *whew*
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 07:22:45 PM
right?!

especially in contrast to how many folks win with their first entry.  *whew*
Dude, sorry but the winners' circle is thataway ---->

(http://www.en.kolobok.us/smiles/standart/beee.gif)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 21, 2016, 07:43:34 PM
Thanks again for great work, @Raptori (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=38840)! Very interesting to see. I didn't know (or realized) that first time winning was a thing!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 07:46:18 PM
Happy to help, it's interesting stuff!  ;D

I'd noticed on the sheet that a fair few people had won with their first or second submission, didn't realise it was quite so prevalent though. Good to have the stats to back us up when we say the contest is newbie-friendly! I do wonder whether it's slightly skewed by the data from the early years of the contest though...
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 21, 2016, 08:10:11 PM
I do wonder whether it's slightly skewed by the data from the early years of the contest though...
I'm sure it is. Fewer entries, no regulars... Chances to win with a first entry were definitely higher.
I bet it looks different if you only count from when I took over.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 08:17:42 PM
I do wonder whether it's slightly skewed by the data from the early years of the contest though...
I'm sure it is. Fewer entries, no regulars... Chances to win with a first entry were definitely higher.
I bet it looks different if you only count from when I took over.
Which month was that? Should really mark it with a line on the spreadsheet!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: xiagan on September 21, 2016, 08:27:19 PM
From my head I'd say Dec'13. But let me check...
Yep. So let's say Jan'14 for a clean start. :)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 08:36:45 PM
From my head I'd say Dec'13. But let me check...
Yep. So let's say Jan'14 for a clean start. :)
Coolio!

*Raptori disappears for a while*
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 21, 2016, 09:17:53 PM
Done! I've put the new and old stats in for ease of comparison. It doesn't change a huge amount; repeat winners increase by 10%, new winners decrease by 10%, debut winners decrease by 20%. (Therefore new winners whose story is not their debut increase by 10%.)

(http://i.imgur.com/Ka7GlmJ.gif)


Entries before first win for all winners:

(http://i.imgur.com/wHwH6At.gif) (http://i.imgur.com/iNASxPV.gif)


Total wins and total entries for contest winners:

(http://i.imgur.com/oFG3uvN.gif) (http://i.imgur.com/gHZ4EEY.gif)


Regulars who have not yet won a contest:

This didn't change at all. Every single person who entered five contests or more before @xiagan (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1148) took over won at least once.  :o Probably due to the low number of entrants more than anything else.

So, stats remain the same: 242 total entrants, 47 have entered 5 contests or more. 14 have not yet won  (30%).

(http://i.imgur.com/Uj3T06F.gif)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: ArcaneArtsVelho on September 21, 2016, 09:24:40 PM
How on earth did I not notice that I wrote my last reply into the quote from Raptori.  ::)
Fixed.
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 21, 2016, 10:53:59 PM
am i the only one that wants to formally designate time periods of the contest?

BX (before xiagan) - pronounced "BACKS".
AX (after xiagan) - pronounced "ACKS".

ax ftw.  chop, chop.

also, i was browsing through those old contests.  man, they were crazy:
http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/january-2013-anthropomorphic-animals/january-2013-writing-contest/
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Arry on September 21, 2016, 11:52:34 PM
Every single person who entered five contests or more before @xiagan (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1148) took over won at least once.  :o Probably due to the low number of entrants more than anything else.

Yeah, that definitely made it easier to win before as many people were participating. Even I won once (and I suck  ;D )
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Nora on September 22, 2016, 12:03:24 AM
But wait... I won on my eighth (8th) entry. Am I reading this correctly? Probably not. A lot of those are lost on me, but :

am i the only one that wants to formally designate time periods of the contest?

BX (before xiagan) - pronounced "BACKS".
AX (after xiagan) - pronounced "ACKS".

ax ftw.  chop, chop.

I'd like that as well. It'd also be interesting to get the stats of only times when the contest reached enough numbers to be closer to a competition. Like 9+ or 10+ stories, given that we had months with 19 stories, can we really take into account who won when there were 5 or 6 entries?
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 22, 2016, 12:50:40 AM
Every single person who entered five contests or more before @xiagan (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1148) took over won at least once.  :o Probably due to the low number of entrants more than anything else.

Yeah, that definitely made it easier to win before as many people were participating. Even I won once (and I suck  ;D )

what?!?

i'm SOOOOOoooo going back and finding it now!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Raptori on September 22, 2016, 01:52:38 AM
am i the only one that wants to formally designate time periods of the contest?

BX (before xiagan) - pronounced "BACKS".
AX (after xiagan) - pronounced "ACKS".
Haha I almost put those exact acronyms instead of the words!  ;D


But wait... I won on my eighth (8th) entry. Am I reading this correctly? Probably not.
Nope. Entries before first win. People who won with their first entry entered 0 times before they first won. People who won with their eighth entry entered 7 times before they won.


Every single person who entered five contests or more before @xiagan (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1148) took over won at least once.  :o Probably due to the low number of entrants more than anything else.

Yeah, that definitely made it easier to win before as many people were participating. Even I won once (and I suck  ;D )

what?!?

i'm SOOOOOoooo going back and finding it now!

I demand a m3mnoch-made ebook containing every single story ever entered into the contest. It must be done.  8)
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: m3mnoch on September 22, 2016, 02:04:07 AM
I demand a m3mnoch-made ebook containing every single story ever entered into the contest. It must be done.  8)

oh no.

damn you.

i hadn't even considered that.

that would be AWESOME!
Title: Re: Should a contest winner be ineligible to win the next contest(s)?
Post by: Arry on September 22, 2016, 02:18:50 AM
Every single person who entered five contests or more before @xiagan (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1148) took over won at least once.  :o Probably due to the low number of entrants more than anything else.

Yeah, that definitely made it easier to win before as many people were participating. Even I won once (and I suck  ;D )


what?!?

i'm SOOOOOoooo going back and finding it now!

Theme was Time Travel. There definitely were not nearly as many contestants as there are these days

Havoc Time (http://fantasy-faction.com/2013/monthly-short-story-winner-time-travel)

 It is also absolutely nothing like what I would typically write. Maybe that's why it won  ::)