August 25, 2019, 11:42:12 PM

Author Topic: Politics and other ailments of the real world  (Read 255279 times)

Offline Rostum

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2955 on: December 12, 2018, 08:46:31 PM »
Sorry Bea I cannot agree with you here. There is no balance of trade with the EU.
Despite what the prime minister said she would do what she has actually brought back to the table is utter capitulation to EU terms. This leaves us in a worse place than if we were to stay in the EU and certainly is not leaving the EU it's just ceding the right to have any say in actions to our detriment.

The UK is the EU's largest single market and we export very little in return back to the EU zone. The real risk of hardship will be a lot of goods imported into the UK use Holland as a conduit and tariffs could be imposed at this point making goods from China more expensive.

I would say the Norway deal would give access to the market which I believe is useful but more important to the EU than the UK and retains the freedom of movement which would allay the concerns of those in the UK from EU member states but leaves the UK with no ability to negotiate and still paying as much or more for the privilege.

CETA I know little about but does mean access to the market with limitations, no contributions and it is harder to move money out of the country you should be paying tax in which is no bad thing. You lose access to the ECoHR which was always going to be a casualty of Brexit  and that is likely to be the biggest impact on the most people a lot who complain vociferously about it while seemingly being unaware that is where most of their protections come from and the fact it was drafted by British Lawyers for Churchill to propose to Europe in the 50's.
 

Offline Peat

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2956 on: December 13, 2018, 12:20:44 AM »
I too believe that this is the best achievable by May (or just about anyone) given the composition of Parliament. We were never going to be allowed to stay in the Free Market on the same terms; we were never going to be able to exit the Free Market given what that meant for Irish border; and we were never going to be able to stay in the Free Market in the most straightforwards manner due to the power wielded by the Tory lunatic fringe.

Maybe a better negotiation team would have persuaded the EU that the balance of trade was more important than being seen to preserve the EU political project. I think they'd have had to be very good though to persuade the EU that the balance of trade was worth more than the strength of the EU political project.

Of course, criticism that the deal is worse than staying in the EU is correct.


I haven’t been impressed with this current generation of politicians.

Understatement of the century.

Offline Rostum

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2957 on: December 15, 2018, 06:28:08 PM »
Only in America

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46577152

Lets celebrate destroying what every first world country has except us.

Offline tebakutis

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2958 on: December 15, 2018, 09:58:10 PM »
Only in America

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46577152

Lets celebrate destroying what every first world country has except us.

Just in time for Democrats to take back power in the House.

This was premeditated and timed. If the ACA collapses as a result of this rulings, and premiums rise for the Trump supporters who shouted for this (or they lose their healthcare entirely, thanks to a pre-existing condition) I *guarantee* those same stupid Trump supporters will blame the Democrats in the house for their lost healthcare ... and Fox News will brainwash them to do so.

People who vote Republican are either selfish (rich white folks voting in their own self interest) or stupid (poor white folks voting in the interest of rich white folks, who they wrongly believe they will one day be). And our GOP has that stupidity weaponized and ready to go in every election.

Offline J.R. Darewood

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2959 on: December 16, 2018, 10:40:53 PM »
Only in America

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46577152

Lets celebrate destroying what every first world country has except us.

Look the US probably has *the worst* healthcare situation in the whole world in my opinion (and I agree that republicans are, in broad strokes, trying to make it worse)...

but to provide a counterpoint here this isn't "dismantling ACA"

The individual mandate was found to be unconstitutional. That's something I have to fully applaud.  The individual mandate was, in my opinion, morally reprehensible (forcing poor people who can't afford it to pay the very insurance companies that have destroyed our healthcare system is *NOT* by any stretch of the imagination "expanding access to healthcare". It's fucking disgusting. The black market pharmaceuticals in my neighborhood are what make any sort of healthcare even possible for the millions of poor people I live with, they barely scrape by day to day, and they find themselves faced with a healthcare penalty they can't afford and that is utterly useless to them anyway--they're on the brink due to rising housing costs, can barely afford food and it pushes them over the edge) My fear was that the republicans beholden to the insurance lobby would leave the individual mandate while dismantling insurance company regulation (ie pre-existing conditions), but I'm really heartened that they didn't do that, and i think this is a really good move.

The Supreme Court previously upheld the individual mandate  (but allowed the expansion of medicare to be optional based on the state, meaning red states have never seen any of the benefits of that expansion while overburdening the poor with the individual mandate, and experiencing coverage restrictions as a result of insurance companies tightening their belts)

So I have to say, this is actually really good news that has been spun to look bad.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2018, 10:48:15 PM by J.R. Darewood »

Offline Skip

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2960 on: December 17, 2018, 04:26:47 AM »
I'm all for the mandate. What we really need is a national health care system, toward which the mandate was a first step.

We have it for cars. Everyone pays. And somehow people are able to afford it. The reason why rates are not higher is exactly because the costs are spread across the whole population.

Requiring everyone to have health insurance is nothing but sensible. It spreads the costs as widely as possible. The only reason why we have any sort of issue regarding the mandate is because the cowards in Congress wouldn't pass full legislation, so we get these half-measures supplemented by executive order. Our health care system resembles a group project done by third graders.

But removing the mandate isn't going to help the poor one whit.
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Offline J.R. Darewood

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2961 on: December 17, 2018, 10:09:25 AM »

You can choose not to own a car.
The mandate is a tax on poor people, with the money going to the very insurance companies that caused the American healthcare crisis.

I fail to see how an individual mandate is a stepping stone toward national health care.  In fact it's the opposite. The expansion of medicare (and who's eligible for it) would be the right step to take.  The individual mandate is the expansion of shady insurance racket, only creating a lobby of self-interested actors who will then shape parasitic policy in the future.

Spoiler for Hiden:
For my neighbors-- the woman who cleans houses, the guys who work the night shift at 7eleven and sleep four to a room-- they barely scrape by paying transportation costs, food and rising rent.  This destroys them.

I worked in healthcare for 3 years and almost went to medical school.
50% of healthcare costs go to insurance profits. Much of the remaining 50% goes to paying for more insurance (malpractice).  That which doesn't goes to nepotistic relationships with suppliers that charge a kajillion dollars for a toilet seat.  Nevermind the criminal state of pharmaceutical companies overcharging for their drugs. Hospital protocols put patients at risk to make decisions based upon profitability, not patient health.

Household debt in the US i larger than the national debt.  It's astronomical. An estimated 50% of this is related to healthcare costs.  And they keep going up.

Meanwhile, in Mexico, where many people are uninsured, the cost of medicine is dramatically lower.  You can go to an open pharmacy and get almost anything (except for sudafed, that's illegal).  It is illegal for people from the US to go to Canada or Mexico to get medicine.  How the hell is that right?

When my neighbor gets sick, she goes down the street to get antibiotics from the woman who keeps them stashed in plastic bags under the herbs she sells on the street.  They cost 3$ for a box of 2.  As opposed to waiting 3 weeks to see a doctor with an overpriced copay to be referred to a specialist 5 weeks later with an even worse copay to get drugs that might or might not be covered-- and see a doctor who doesn't see their patients again or truly know if their treatments are working (they're just following a protocol), my neighbor is seen instantly by someone who has decades of experience with sick people coming to her, and coming back the next day to say hello.

So why should my neighbor go into debt paying for a service she can't use, to empower the evil companies that make healthcare 3-4 times as expensive while providing no benefit to the system?


Offline Rostum

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2962 on: December 25, 2018, 07:23:46 PM »

Offline Eli_Freysson

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2963 on: January 05, 2019, 11:26:16 AM »
So, just out of morbid curiosity, how much damage is Trump's shutdown of the American government doing to the country? And how much damage will it go on to do if it stretches on for months, as he's threatened? Can he actually break the country with this?

And what are the odds that Vladimir Putin is rubbing himself while watching this go down?
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Offline Skip

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2964 on: January 05, 2019, 06:10:44 PM »
We're a very big country. Some people it is affecting directly and severely; others not at all. The longer it goes, the greater will be the effects. Sorry if all that sounds terribly obvious, but sometimes it's worth mentioning that "the country" is an abstraction. What we're really talking about here are three crucial components: people, institutions, and traditions or precedents.

We've had shutdowns before, though none prior to 1976. That's simply because we didn't have a legal definition in place. The Wikipedia article has a pretty good discussion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_shutdowns_in_the_United_States
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Offline J.R. Darewood

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2965 on: January 05, 2019, 06:44:19 PM »
It shuts down almost every time Congress is controlled by a different party than the President. I can think of at least 3 times it shot down. The media has a field day as if the sky is falling but honestly I feel like this government does far less damage when it's shut down so I'm all for it. Maybe they'll stay that way for 2 more years and I won't have to read about Trump anymore

Offline Rostum

Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2966 on: January 14, 2019, 11:29:11 AM »
this sort of belongs here as stupid people are definitely an ailment of the real world

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46846981

In a sane world anyone caught doing this should immediately have their licence revoked as they are unfit to be responsible for a motor vehicle and a danger to themselves and others.

Offline ScarletBea

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2967 on: January 14, 2019, 12:13:26 PM »
this sort of belongs here as stupid people are definitely an ailment of the real world

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46846981

In a sane world anyone caught doing this should immediately have their licence revoked as they are unfit to be responsible for a motor vehicle and a danger to themselves and others.
:o :o
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Offline J.R. Darewood

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2968 on: January 16, 2019, 12:03:42 AM »
Haha I saw that a while ago @Rostum . I only wish I had been blindfolded during the movie it was so bad. 

There have been all these pictures of fries and hamburgers in my FB feed for the past couple of day and I only just now figured out why. WTAF.


Offline tebakutis

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Re: Politics and other ailments of the real world
« Reply #2969 on: January 16, 2019, 03:25:30 PM »
Haha I saw that a while ago @Rostum . I only wish I had been blindfolded during the movie it was so bad. 

There have been all these pictures of fries and hamburgers in my FB feed for the past couple of day and I only just now figured out why. WTAF.



I believe you're thinking of hamberders.