Fantasy Faction

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Lady Ty on March 25, 2015, 11:39:22 AM

Title: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Lady Ty on March 25, 2015, 11:39:22 AM
Hope we all agree

http://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2015/mar/25/iceland-construction-respect-elves-or-else?CMP=soc_568
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Justan Henner on March 25, 2015, 01:45:24 PM
Oh dear...

Quote
“For the huge Kárahnjúkastífla dam project in the east, consultants with clairvoyant skills were hired to check out the landscape first to ensure it was empty of elvish rocks. There’s now money to be made in this sort of consultancy work.”

Clearly I've chosen the wrong career path.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 25, 2015, 03:21:43 PM
I love this whole thing.
I will shamelessly steal this and put it into a story sometime.  ;D
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on March 25, 2015, 11:52:29 PM
I know they've censored some of the old Enid Blyton's and replaced the 'naughty' golliwogs with goblins. I wonder if anyone is going to protest that they're being discriminatory against the goblins there?
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 26, 2015, 12:13:15 AM
I know they've censored some of the old Enid Blyton's and replaced the 'naughty' golliwogs with goblins. I wonder if anyone is going to protest that they're being discriminatory against the goblins there?
In our summer cabin, as a child, I found an old Golliwog book that was falling apart. I had no idea that the characters were bigoted stereotypes of African-Americans. The books require updating if they're to be used with modern children rather than relegated to museums and doctoral theses.

"Little Black Sambo" is more complicated. It was based in southern India, but in the U.S. some editions dropped the original illustrations and substituted polliwog style figures so that it became about African-Americans. The story itself is quite nice and unbiased. But the title of the book, the names of the characters and many of the illustrations over time meant that the lovely story was undermined. I remember reading this as a child, and not seeing the racial overtones at all. And I grew up in a very liberal and socially-conscious family.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 26, 2015, 12:16:32 AM
Now on a slightly more cheerful note, I've heard that the new versions of The Hobbit are replacing goblins with Martians; since we are certain there are no Martians, but the existence of goblins is still a possibility  ;)
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on March 26, 2015, 12:49:23 AM
I know they've censored some of the old Enid Blyton's and replaced the 'naughty' golliwogs with goblins. I wonder if anyone is going to protest that they're being discriminatory against the goblins there?
In our summer cabin, as a child, I found an old Golliwog book that was falling apart. I had no idea that the characters were bigoted stereotypes of African-Americans. The books require updating if they're to be used with modern children rather than relegated to museums and doctoral theses.

"Little Black Sambo" is more complicated. It was based in southern India, but in the U.S. some editions dropped the original illustrations and substituted polliwog style figures so that it became about African-Americans. The story itself is quite nice and unbiased. But the title of the book, the names of the characters and many of the illustrations over time meant that the lovely story was undermined. I remember reading this as a child, and not seeing the racial overtones at all. And I grew up in a very liberal and socially-conscious family.
They've gone after the Enid Blyton's with a big stick. The original names of the characters in the Faraway Tree books were Jo (a boy), Bessie and Fanny, in the second book they were joined by Dick. Now they names have been altered to Joe (apparently not having the 'e' confuses people), Beth (Bessie is too archaic) and Frannie (because well the other name has been appropriated to mean something different, although when these books were originally written in the 1930's it was in usage, my mother actually had an Aunty Fan) Dick is now Rick (because again it means something else these days. I wonder how Australian businessman and adventurer Dick Smith feels about that?). The worrying thing about censorship like this is that they can do these things to the books, because I think they're public domain. I spoke about to a friend of mine who majored in English Literature at uni, and what concerned him was that what if someone decides down the track that Dickens is too depressing, or Shakespeare too dirty? They've already tried to remove the n word from Mark Twain's books, and I actually found that far less offensive than the racial stereotyping done in Edgar Rice Burroughs original Tarzan of the Apes.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 26, 2015, 01:06:13 AM
Yes, the racial stereotyping in Burroughs is pretty heavy.
Shakespeare censorship was done by Bowdler (hence: "to bowdlerize"), plus there was a version of the Bible with all the naughty bits removed.  :P

@Elfy (http://fantasy-faction.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=1153), Maybe you're right; the answer is just put it out there and let people do with it as they will. But I do hate the idea of people being offended by things that are so patently racist, even that wasn't the conscious intent of the author.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Lady Ty on March 26, 2015, 02:54:36 AM
I truly liked the way the Icelanders think and Jmacyk it would be glorious to see a story where big business construction had to literally have board meetings with the elves and goblins and anyone else caught up in development.  Just thinking of the devious hard nosed concessions that could be wrung out from the humans.  ;D

This subject has taken a welcome serious turn but I would never have titled it as I did except for the original link.  ;D
 
Retrospective censoring of any literature makes me see red and steam comes out of my ears. One of my rant subjects is criticism of past literature without taking into consideration or having some knowledge of the era in which it was written. Literature of all kinds is social history, it reflects exactly the attitudes and customs of the day, whether it concerns racism, religion sex etc and we should read it  in that light.  Also giving a thought to the different type of readers it was  aimed at, such as the author's peers, or to influence politics, or the so-called "working class" or Victorians sitting around while Papa read to the family and so on.

Of course Dickens is depressing, he was trying to draw attention to appalling conditions, disease, extreme poverty, huge social divide between wealthy and poor of Victorian England. No point trying to pretend life was good.

As for cutting the dirty bits out of Shakespeare it's not all easily recognised, but the raucous crowds in the Globe Theatre loved and enjoyed all those double meanings, it helped those with pretty hard lives have some fun and the more we know the better we can appreciate his brilliance with words.  I had a Jewish friend who would not read Shakespeare because he had been highly offended by the portrayal of Shylock and I could understand why, but that was exactly how the Jews were perceived and treated then.

Agatha Christie, from 20thC, has several racist stereotypes which have not been changed, although the  title of one novel,  "Then There Were One", is not as I first knew it.

Modern day censoring of previous racial content seems to come from guilt, but  that is exactly how white people spoke and acted towards all people of colour not just black people. Orientals had a hard time of it as well.  We should be able to read and feel disgust but not try to pretend it didn't happen rather face it.  This type of censoring is a covert way of re-writing history and it seriously bothers me.

Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Saraband on March 26, 2015, 09:32:06 AM
I truly liked the way the Icelanders think and Jmacyk it would be glorious to see a story where big business construction had to literally have board meetings with the elves and goblins and anyone else caught up in development.  Just thinking of the devious hard nosed concessions that could be wrung out from the humans.  ;D

This subject has taken a welcome serious turn but I would never have titled it as I did except for the original link.  ;D
 
Retrospective censoring of any literature makes me see red and steam comes out of my ears. One of my rant subjects is criticism of past literature without taking into consideration or having some knowledge of the era in which it was written. Literature of all kinds is social history, it reflects exactly the attitudes and customs of the day, whether it concerns racism, religion sex etc and we should read it  in that light.  Also giving a thought to the different type of readers it was  aimed at, such as the author's peers, or to influence politics, or the so-called "working class" or Victorians sitting around while Papa read to the family and so on.

Of course Dickens is depressing, he was trying to draw attention to appalling conditions, disease, extreme poverty, huge social divide between wealthy and poor of Victorian England. No point trying to pretend life was good.

As for cutting the dirty bits out of Shakespeare it's not all easily recognised, but the raucous crowds in the Globe Theatre loved and enjoyed all those double meanings, it helped those with pretty hard lives have some fun and the more we know the better we can appreciate his brilliance with words.  I had a Jewish friend who would not read Shakespeare because he had been highly offended by the portrayal of Shylock and I could understand why, but that was exactly how the Jews were perceived and treated then.

Agatha Christie, from 20thC, has several racist stereotypes which have not been changed, although the  title of one novel,  "Then There Were One", is not as I first knew it.

Modern day censoring of previous racial content seems to come from guilt, but  that is exactly how white people spoke and acted towards all people of colour not just black people. Orientals had a hard time of it as well.  We should be able to read and feel disgust but not try to pretend it didn't happen rather face it.  This type of censoring is a covert way of re-writing history and it seriously bothers me.

I thought of joining in after the thread took a more serious turn, but then @Lady Ty wrote many of the things I thought about with far more eloquence.

I would emphasize the importance of literature in understanding the social context of the time in which a book was written. I mean, how better to understand the roaring twenties than opening one of Francis Scott Fitzgerald's many masterpieces? Instead of putting censored versions on the hands of the new generations, we should have them confront the original versions and discuss why they are offensive today.

Bleaching the past doesn't make it right. Otherwise we will never learn from our mistakes.

There was a version of the Bible with all the naughty bits removed.  :P

I don't think there would be much left from the Old Testament in particular  :P

Oh dear...

Quote
“For the huge Kárahnjúkastífla dam project in the east, consultants with clairvoyant skills were hired to check out the landscape first to ensure it was empty of elvish rocks. There’s now money to be made in this sort of consultancy work.”

Clearly I've chosen the wrong career path.


I wonder if this could solve Portugal's unemployment crisis? If something could, it would certainly have to do with elves  ;D
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 26, 2015, 11:28:35 AM
I truly liked the way the Icelanders think and Jmacyk it would be glorious to see a story where big business construction had to literally have board meetings with the elves and goblins and anyone else caught up in development.  Just thinking of the devious hard nosed concessions that could be wrung out from the humans.  ;D
@LadyTy: You imp, you.  :-* Just when I'm turning my mind back to one of my WsIP, you suggest this lovely story-starter. And now the brownies of my imagination are running amok in the cobbler shop.

May take me a few days... (or more, if I'm really going for devious) ;D
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Lady Ty on March 26, 2015, 11:52:11 PM

I would emphasize the importance of literature in understanding the social context of the time in which a book was written. I mean, how better to understand the roaring twenties than opening one of Francis Scott Fitzgerald's many masterpieces? Instead of putting censored versions on the hands of the new generations, we should have them confront the original versions and discuss why they are offensive today.

Bleaching the past doesn't make it right. Otherwise we will never learn from our mistakes.

For the new generations to read and discuss the originals is exactly how it should be, Saraband, couldn't agree more. Glad you agree with my feelings on this, I don't often rant ;)

On a totally unrelated point, if you like FSG have a look at the link here

http://www.nickigreenberg.com/the-great-gatsby/

I am lucky enough to have this book and although it may seem weird it is absolutely brilliant. That clip doesn't show enough but Nikki Greenberg is so incredibly clever, she has also done an amazing Inkblot Hamlet .
You can see more in Google images, I can't do short links properly.


@LadyTy: You imp, you.  :-* Just when I'm turning my mind back to one of my WsIP, you suggest this lovely story-starter. And now the brownies of my imagination are running amok in the cobbler shop.

May take me a few days... (or more, if I'm really going for devious) ;D
No rush, son, incredibly OTT devious and wicked sounds good. I'll be looking forward to it........... ;D
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Lady Ty on March 30, 2015, 10:01:57 AM
Still off topic but had to share as we were discussing censorship and didn't know where else to post it.

A couple in Idaho have brought out the Clean Read App and a catalogue of books where it can be applied.  It will change all the naughty words in your e-books to good decent clean language. So now you know.  ;D How about that.  ;D Just google it and read some of the hilarious articles going around. 

Apparently you can choose Clean, Cleaner, Squeaky Clean depending on your mood.

My thought is if you don't like explicit language or can't accept swearing, then you should be choosing your books more carefully,maybe I'm missing something here, or am I being too judgmental? I just found it funny really.


Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Saraband on March 30, 2015, 10:17:20 AM
Still off topic but had to share as we were discussing censorship and didn't know where else to post it.

A couple in Idaho have brought out the Clean Read App and a catalogue of books where it can be applied.  It will change all the naughty words in your e-books to good decent clean language. So now you know.  ::)How about that.  ;D Just google it and read some of the hilarious articles going around. 

Apparently you can choose Clean, Cleaner, Squeaky Clean depending on your mood.

My thought is if you don't like explicit language or can't accept swearing, then you should be choosing your books more carefully,maybe I'm missing something here, or am I being too judgmental?

If anything I think you're being too soft. I can't empathize with someone who can't bear the thought of hearing/reading a 'naughty' word, as if that was a real problem in our f****d up world. We don't mind reading about torture, rape and guts being spilled on the floor, but the moment we use the most common synonym for the act of making love to another human being it all goes suddenly wrong.

Anyway, that app must have its fun uses in certain books ;D
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Rostum on March 30, 2015, 04:27:47 PM
I cannot agree more emphatically revisionist readings destroy the original context of any historical text. If something written 500 or 50 years ago is out of synch with our perceptions of society or our personal views either don't read it or strive to understand the context it was written in. If it would be socially unacceptable to write such a thing now there should be no issue with being able to discuss the work and the reasons it is now not socially acceptable.

With regard to your Idaho profanity filter. I can only apologise for a terrible mistake my Nation made in encouraging a 100 or so religious fundamentalists to leave our shores for yours in 1620. We thought they were just a nuisance. Had we have known...

A long time ago as my daughter was just finishing up at nursery school a very serious note was sent home with her saying that the singing of BA BA Blacksheep would be changed to BA BA Rainbowsheep. Apparently the use of the word black even in the correct context is offensive, who knew.

BTW if you are a mind to go looking there is an Icelander who is a Elf sex expert (I am guessing self proclaimed) who has published a book.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on March 30, 2015, 11:26:35 PM
Still off topic but had to share as we were discussing censorship and didn't know where else to post it.

A couple in Idaho have brought out the Clean Read App and a catalogue of books where it can be applied.  It will change all the naughty words in your e-books to good decent clean language. So now you know.  ;D How about that.  ;D Just google it and read some of the hilarious articles going around. 

Apparently you can choose Clean, Cleaner, Squeaky Clean depending on your mood.

My thought is if you don't like explicit language or can't accept swearing, then you should be choosing your books more carefully,maybe I'm missing something here, or am I being too judgmental? I just found it funny really.
That's up there with some guy I read on Amazon many years ago who said he used a thick black marker to block out all the swearing and sex in the ASoIaF books. I still don't know if he was serious or taking the piss. The other thing is how do you, or anyone, for that matter, decide what is and isn't dirty, even with the 3 options? Let's have us a good old book fuelled bonfire.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 31, 2015, 12:16:19 AM
Still off topic but had to share as we were discussing censorship and didn't know where else to post it.

A couple in Idaho have brought out the Clean Read App and a catalogue of books where it can be applied.  It will change all the naughty words in your e-books to good decent clean language. So now you know.  ;D How about that.  ;D Just google it and read some of the hilarious articles going around. 

Apparently you can choose Clean, Cleaner, Squeaky Clean depending on your mood.

My thought is if you don't like explicit language or can't accept swearing, then you should be choosing your books more carefully,maybe I'm missing something here, or am I being too judgmental? I just found it funny really.
That's up there with some guy I read on Amazon many years ago who said he used a thick black marker to block out all the swearing and sex in the ASoIaF books. I still don't know if he was serious or taking the piss. The other thing is how do you, or anyone, for that matter, decide what is and isn't dirty, even with the 3 options? Let's have us a good old book fuelled bonfire.
451 degrees Fahrenheit, baby.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Lady Ty on March 31, 2015, 01:10:30 AM
That's up there with some guy I read on Amazon many years ago who said he used a thick black marker to block out all the swearing and sex in the ASoIaF books. I still don't know if he was serious or taking the piss. The other thing is how do you, or anyone, for that matter, decide what is and isn't dirty, even with the 3 options? Let's have us a good old book fuelled bonfire.
451 degrees Fahrenheit, baby.

Laughed about the ASoIAF guy, must have taken him weeks.

The burning of  books also came to my mind after reading about the App and sad it still happens in some countries. In US they often seem to challenge books for school and libraries . In 2012  a top 10 of school/library challenged books included  - To Kill a Mockingbird,  The Hunger Games and Brave New World amongst many others. Hopefully they didn't succeed.

With regard to your Idaho profanity filter. I can only apologise for a terrible mistake my Nation made in encouraging a 100 or so religious fundamentalists to leave our shores for yours in 1620. We thought they were just a nuisance. Had we have known...

A long time ago as my daughter was just finishing up at nursery school a very serious note was sent home with her saying that the singing of BA BA Blacksheep would be changed to BA BA Rainbowsheep. Apparently the use of the word black even in the correct context is offensive, who knew.

BTW if you are a mind to go looking there is an Icelander who is a Elf sex expert (I am guessing self proclaimed) who has published a book.

 ;D ;D Rostum  no need to apologise to me about the Pilgrim Fathers and their increasingly weird fundamental successors. I live in the future like Elfy and we are very laid back about use of blunt language.

Have to say BA BA Rainbowsheep was very original and I quite like the picture it conjures up, being a staunch supporter of diversity, but makes it harder to sing   :D

Did wonder if the Elf sex expert cites from case histories?
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on March 31, 2015, 03:26:10 AM


Laughed about the ASoIAF guy, must have taken him weeks.

The burning of  books also came to my mind after reading about the App and sad it still happens in some countries. In US they often seem to challenge books for school and libraries . In 2012  a top 10 of school/library challenged books included  - To Kill a Mockingbird,  The Hunger Games and Brave New World amongst many others. Hopefully they didn't succeed.


I wondered if the same person also read The Lies of Locke Lamora, he would have run his marker out of ink with that one.
Catcher in the Rye was banned in the States for many years, although it later became required reading. Wasn't there a hoohah not that long ago about people wanting Harry Potter banned because it promoted the use of witchcraft? I also think people have campaigned against Darwin's On The Origin of the Species, because it champions evolution. It's rather like the Inquisition demanding Galileo retract his views that the world revolved around the sun, not the other way around. Censorship rarely works.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: JMack on March 31, 2015, 03:43:59 AM
We lived in Alabama for several years, in the heart of "the Bible Belt."

One day we got a call from our daughter's elementary school.
She was in trouble for bringing a D&D rules book to school, because it had things about witches and demons, plus strange occult drawings. My wife ripped th principal a new one over it. Later, there was much suspicion over Harry Potter.

There was also the time we went to a family festival where they were giving away soccer balls to the kids, a football to the dads and a chance to win a buggy full of groceries to the women. When my wife asked for a football, she was informed quite seriously that since the man is the head of the family, he would be the only one to get a football. We just about had to handcuff Lisa to keep her hands off the fella's neck.  ;D
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on March 31, 2015, 04:34:54 AM
We lived in Alabama for several years, in the heart of "the Bible Belt."

One day we got a call from our daughter's elementary school.
She was in trouble for bringing a D&D rules book to school, because it had things about witches and demons, plus strange occult drawings. My wife ripped th principal a new one over it. Later, there was much suspicion over Harry Potter.

There was also the time we went to a family festival where they were giving away soccer balls to the kids, a football to the dads and a chance to win a buggy full of groceries to the women. When my wife asked for a football, she was informed quite seriously that since the man is the head of the family, he would be the only one to get a football. We just about had to handcuff Lisa to keep her hands off the fella's neck.  ;D
Different world, isn't it? We have a female rugby commentator down here, and she got a match ball after a game one night. She gave it to her young daughter, and then a day or two later she saw her daughter with the football, she had it wrapped in a blanket and was nursing it like a baby!
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Saraband on March 31, 2015, 09:01:25 AM
There was also the time we went to a family festival where they were giving away soccer balls to the kids, a football to the dads and a chance to win a buggy full of groceries to the women. When my wife asked for a football, she was informed quite seriously that since the man is the head of the family, he would be the only one to get a football. We just about had to handcuff Lisa to keep her hands off the fella's neck.  ;D

+Karma for your wife  :D

Well, talking about censorship, Portugal's only Literature Nobel, José Saramago, pretty much went into self-imposed exile in Spain because our government at the time refused to consider his book The Gospel According to Jesus Christ for the Aristeion Prize (a no longer existing european literature prize), as it offended Catholic values - and this was in the early 90's.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Justan Henner on March 31, 2015, 05:33:19 PM
I also think people have campaigned against Darwin's On The Origin of the Species, because it champions evolution.

This is actually a bit of an understatement in the US. It's an issue that pops up every now and then, depending on the state. In my state (California) it's illegal to teach Creationism in schools (I believe it's actually illegal in every state, but I'm not 100% certain) and mandatory to teach evolution (in public schools at least) but students have to get signed permission slips from their parents in order to participate. As recent as 2008, some states have been trying to pass laws requiring Creationism to be taught any time Evolution is taught.

I remember in a philosophy class I took in college, we watched a video of teacher's caught teaching Creationism and I recall its tone being somewhat similar to one of those "here's ten minutes of horrific animal slaughter, never eat meat again", type videos. Meanwhile the other side is putting stickers on science books that say, "this is not fact, it's theory," so the propaganda machines are still very much running on both sides.

As someone confident in his ability to brainwash children, I don't really have a dog in the fight, so it can be pretty entertaining to watch.  ;)
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on April 01, 2015, 12:40:47 AM
I also think people have campaigned against Darwin's On The Origin of the Species, because it champions evolution.

This is actually a bit of an understatement in the US. It's an issue that pops up every now and then, depending on the state. In my state (California) it's illegal to teach Creationism in schools (I believe it's actually illegal in every state, but I'm not 100% certain) and mandatory to teach evolution (in public schools at least) but students have to get signed permission slips from their parents in order to participate. As recent as 2008, some states have been trying to pass laws requiring Creationism to be taught any time Evolution is taught.

I remember in a philosophy class I took in college, we watched a video of teacher's caught teaching Creationism and I recall its tone being somewhat similar to one of those "here's ten minutes of horrific animal slaughter, never eat meat again", type videos. Meanwhile the other side is putting stickers on science books that say, "this is not fact, it's theory," so the propaganda machines are still very much running on both sides.

As someone confident in his ability to brainwash children, I don't really have a dog in the fight, so it can be pretty entertaining to watch.  ;)
Wasn't that what the Monkey Scopes trial was all about, though? The one where Clarence Darrow made his name?
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Justan Henner on April 01, 2015, 04:02:46 AM
Wasn't that what the Monkey Scopes trial was all about, though? The one where Clarence Darrow made his name?

Yes. But Scopes was convicted for teaching evolution, it had to be overturned in court, and even then it wasn't until the 60's-70's that it became common to teach evolution in schools. In the 1980's Louisiana passed a law requiring Creationism to be taught in schools, which went to the Supreme Court and was overturned due to a clause in the America Constitution forbidding the Establishment of a state religion, (making it illegal from then on). Don't know how it is in Australia, but Creationism has lost pretty much all these fights since the Scope's Trial on pretty similar grounds (so from the 1920's onward). Since then, the Creationists have turned toward Intelligent Design, essentially trying to pass creationism off as a scientific alternative to evolution, so it pops up every now and then under that guise.

I'm not sure if it's 100% illegal to teach creationism in science classes (only illegal to require it be taught), for example, in my school they taught creationism in a history class as part of a world religions unit, alongside teachings from Buddhism, Hinduism, etc. but not as science. Every time it pops up, either as stickers on text books or some state legislature passing laws requiring creationism/ID to be taught with equal regard compared to evolution, the people who implemented the law tend to lose the next election and then the law is repealed.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Elfy on April 01, 2015, 04:15:11 AM
I can't ever remember them teaching anything other than evolution in school. I went to a Catholic primary school, so we got the biblical creation myth, but it was accepted by everyone, including the teachers some of whom were nuns, that this was a bible story and not to be confused with the science behind the big bang theory and evolution. I'd be surprised if any school in Australia was different. Despite Adelaide being called 'the city of churches' I don't think we have an equivalent to the bible belt here.
Title: Re: Get those priorities right and show some respect.......
Post by: Justan Henner on April 01, 2015, 04:33:50 AM
I can't ever remember them teaching anything other than evolution in school. I went to a Catholic primary school, so we got the biblical creation myth, but it was accepted by everyone, including the teachers some of whom were nuns, that this was a bible story and not to be confused with the science behind the big bang theory and evolution. I'd be surprised if any school in Australia was different. Despite Adelaide being called 'the city of churches' I don't think we have an equivalent to the bible belt here.

Pretty much the same was true for me, as I reached the level of education when evolution is taught while living in California, but if I had still been in Utah at the time, it may have been different. That's not to say Mormon's don't believe in evolution, in fact most I know do believe in it, but I think it depends on the region, the church in question, and specific people themselves. I've had a few conversations with family members that have treated evolution as an impossibility, while other family members accept it as a part of their faith. Could be the schools are teaching different things, could be how active their local church is in advocating against/for it, or it could just be personal experience.