April 11, 2021, 02:23:36 AM

Author Topic: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF  (Read 459 times)

Offline eclipse

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What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« on: March 07, 2021, 09:01:47 AM »
What would you consider to be the difference  between Urban Fantasy and Paranormal Romance?

Is Urban fantasy just Paranormal romance with the romance aspect removed?

Is  the Dresden series a Paranormal romance with the Murphy relationship?

Can book be labelled as urban/paranormal  fantasy if it set in a secondary world like the craft sequence series/Terry Pratchett watch and Gentleman bastard series ? ( I’ve seen  all three  series on urban fantasy lists a few times because it’s set in a city , personally I don’t think it counts as UF , well maybe the craft sequence does) 

Or do you mainly see Uf/Pr as books set in our world?


Would you consider Harry Potter  as Urban Fantasy ? ( I’ve seen Harry Potter listed a few times on best urban fantasy lists)

« Last Edit: March 07, 2021, 09:04:11 AM by eclipse »
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Offline S. K. Inkslinger

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2021, 09:09:38 AM »
I mean you can usually tell something is paranormal romance by the amount of hot males and females around, six packs, naked bodies, and vivid sultry description and what not. I definitely don't see Dresden as paranormal romance, even with the Murphy aspect. Also one of the person engaged in romance should be a non-human in someway I think (hot werewolf, vampires, fae, etc.) .

Offline eclipse

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2021, 09:18:22 AM »
That’s what I would have thought too but people seem to lump the two together.

Is there anything called countryside/rural fantasy hehe. Oh seems that there is

https://io9.gizmodo.com/what-are-the-great-rural-fantasy-novels-5550530
« Last Edit: March 07, 2021, 09:21:48 AM by eclipse »
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Offline ScarletBea

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2021, 09:33:16 AM »
I don't mix the 2, but I agree with this:
Or do you mainly see Uf/Pr as books set in our world?
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Offline cupiscent

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2021, 10:35:20 AM »
I would expect things labelled urban fantasy or paranormal romance to be set in real-world cities - possibly made-up cities, but still intended to be within our known world, with some extra additions.

Definitely Gladstone's Craft sequence are challenging, because they are so clearly channelling that urban-fantasy vibe, within an entirely second-world setting, though with very strong correlation to real-world locations and concepts. (In a way, it's much like the Discworld, though in a different time period.)

For me, urban fantasy (with a romance subplot) and paranormal romance are separated the same way as fantasy (with a romance subplot) and fantasy romance - what's the key focus? Is it a romance book with fantasy stuff, or a fantasy book with romance stuff?

(This said, my personal goodreads tags don't follow this, because they're for me and not for helping others. ;D I label a book "urban" if it has an urban setting in whatever world, and "seriously urban" if that setting lies at the very heart of the story. So Craft, Lowtown, Matthew Swift, Rivers of London - all yes. But not e.g. the Divine Cities books, which despite their names are not really about their settings.)

Offline Elfy

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2021, 11:27:11 AM »
Tad Williams refers to The War of the Flowers as urban fantasy. A lot of things fit into the classifications. I tend to put everything under the heading of fantasy and science fiction now, and even they can bleed into each other sometimes.
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Offline Peat

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2021, 12:43:43 PM »
For something to have Romance in the genre name the romance has to be a primary plot to the point where removing the romance causes the story to fall apart. If the love story can be removed, it's not Romance. So no, Dresden isn't a romance.

That's the clear cut one.

I'm never entirely sure whether UF should be real world cities only, but there's a strong argument it should. There's also a trend of using Urban for Modern (see rural urban fantasy) which muddies it.
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Offline Bender

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2021, 05:59:03 PM »
One is dominant theme and other is dominant setting. I don't see how they overlap other than that most PNRs have Urban setting.

PR - In addition to what Inky said, I see PNR as usually involving two different species (popularly, human vs vampire vs werewolf, chose any two)

UF - Has to happen predominantly in a city/town probably as close to Earth-like, but there are exceptions to this too.
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Offline Rostum

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2021, 08:10:06 PM »
I have not read a PR that I would consider a well written book. They seem to be largely churned out to provide a sexual thrill and are outselling fantasy by 10-1 which matters when they are classed together for awards.

I recently introduced a 20-year-old to Rivers of London in an attempt to get her away from the Werewolf (bestiality) and Vampire (Necrophilia) drivel she was stuck on she agreed it was a good read, but she likes what she likes. So I doubt she will pick up book two.

Offline cupiscent

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2021, 10:43:14 PM »
I have not read a PR that I would consider a well written book. They seem to be largely churned out to provide a sexual thrill and are outselling fantasy by 10-1 which matters when they are classed together for awards.

I'm genuinely curious as to how much PR you have read to make that statement. If they do outsell fantasy by such a margin, they must be providing something that readers are willing to spend money on and that therefore makes them good for that audience. I'm not saying that a lot of people liking something means it's good, but--well, no, actually, I am saying that. If people like something, it's good for them, in some way. "Good" is subjective. You or I don't have to like it just because a lot of other people do, but they don't have to stop liking it because we don't.

Offline Bender

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2021, 03:56:46 AM »
I have not read a PR that I would consider a well written book. They seem to be largely churned out to provide a sexual thrill and are outselling fantasy by 10-1 which matters when they are classed together for awards.

I'm genuinely curious as to how much PR you have read to make that statement. If they do outsell fantasy by such a margin, they must be providing something that readers are willing to spend money on and that therefore makes them good for that audience. I'm not saying that a lot of people liking something means it's good, but--well, no, actually, I am saying that. If people like something, it's good for them, in some way. "Good" is subjective. You or I don't have to like it just because a lot of other people do, but they don't have to stop liking it because we don't.

I have dipped my toes into it enough to say it's romance first and fantasy next. I frankly am am as disinterested in human vs human romance as I'm with human with vampire. Kushiel was as boring as Twilight.

I've had this discussion before and I just don't see Phedre as a character, I'd like to read about repeatedly. All I can get from those books is glorified sexual violence given a flimsy fantasy reasoning.

But then, I'm aware that just because I don't see it doesn't mean it isn't there. If others see value (as they obviously do), each to their own.
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Offline wakarimasen

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Re: What would you consider to be the difference from PR and UF
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2021, 09:39:11 AM »
sex sells. 
In a world where 50 Shades outsells the bible we just need to accept that. I think sometimes what happens is fans of a genre get a bit peeved when someone rolls into town and does a sexy novel in their fav style.
I'm sure there are plenty of horse riding fans who depsise Jilly Cooper novels.

I think in the fantasy community we sometimes feel it doubly because the word fantasy so often gets rolled up with sexual fantasy in the wider world. At the end of the day - all fiction romance is sexual fantasy, but not all of it is 'fantasy'.

Pointless musing over. I'm with the 'PR needs interspecies' bonking definition.