July 15, 2020, 05:47:40 PM

Author Topic: I hate poetry  (Read 6638 times)

Offline m3mnoch

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #30 on: September 15, 2016, 10:34:10 PM »
Since I just admitted to reading Paradise Lost aloud (and that's not the first time I've read it), I've already exposed myself as both pretentious, aloof, and snobbish (the whole trifecta), so I got nothing to lose now!

there's no reason to be alarmed, but this sentence just gained you my fandom -- pretentious or not.

/highfive


I think the comment about needing music (which I think I've seen echoed in other posts in this thread) to accompany the poetry is very interesting though. Ideally, a poem should have an intrinsic quality of sound to it; the rhythm, meter, possible alliteration etc. of the verse. I wonder if reading it aloud to hear that quality of sound would make people more amenable towards poetry and not need accompanying music to enjoy it.

music probably lightens the cognitive load.  at least, it does for me.  it employs the "sit back and enjoy" neurotransmitters instead of their anxiety-laden siblings labeled "WHAT IF I MISSED SOMETHING GOOD?!?"

tho, i can't really get slam-poetry out of my head.  reading it aloud automagically invokes scenes from so i married an axe murderer.

yeah.  i'm probably poetry-broken.

Offline Quill

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #31 on: September 15, 2016, 10:52:52 PM »
Since I just admitted to reading Paradise Lost aloud (and that's not the first time I've read it), I've already exposed myself as both pretentious, aloof, and snobbish (the whole trifecta), so I got nothing to lose now!

there's no reason to be alarmed, but this sentence just gained you my fandom -- pretentious or not.

/highfive
/highfives back

I think the comment about needing music (which I think I've seen echoed in other posts in this thread) to accompany the poetry is very interesting though. Ideally, a poem should have an intrinsic quality of sound to it; the rhythm, meter, possible alliteration etc. of the verse. I wonder if reading it aloud to hear that quality of sound would make people more amenable towards poetry and not need accompanying music to enjoy it.

music probably lightens the cognitive load.  at least, it does for me.  it employs the "sit back and enjoy" neurotransmitters instead of their anxiety-laden siblings labeled "WHAT IF I MISSED SOMETHING GOOD?!?"

tho, i can't really get slam-poetry out of my head.  reading it aloud automagically invokes scenes from so i married an axe murderer.

yeah.  i'm probably poetry-broken.
I think that music and language activates two different centres of the brain (which is why people that stutter in speech do not do so in song), so it makes sense that music would alter your perception and enjoyment of a poem.
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Offline m3mnoch

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #32 on: September 15, 2016, 11:11:56 PM »
I contend that the rhythms of poetry are there, and empower these simple words to a level they could not achieve without those rhythms.

totes.

i'm a giant fan of internal rhyme (and, to a lesser extent alliteration) when it comes to wrapping prose in awesome.

a couple things i've written that i found in a couple minutes:
Quote
Her cravings ran more along crunchy cabbage and radishes, and she left gulping down fish and the scattered critters to Theo.
Quote
As she crashed onto the canvas-covered boat, fire splashed out from the deck above her, lighting up the night, and blasted her with heat.

i've got a ton more examples laying around tho -- i'm just too lazy to dig them up, so i'm totally with you on the sound of prose, even if it's not poetry.

Online ScarletBea

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Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #33 on: September 16, 2016, 09:25:48 AM »
@Tanniel, since you like poetry, I wonder if you've read Possession, by A.S. Byatt?
She doesn't write fantasy, but her books are very good.

That one was the first I read from her, and it's based around 2 scholars of english literature, studying 2 victorian poets, and it includes a lot of their poetry (they're not real life people, they've been invented by her).
(I've read the book a few times, some reading everything and I think once skiping the poetry)
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Offline Quill

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #34 on: September 16, 2016, 11:13:05 AM »
@ScarletBea, I haven't, but the premise sounds very interesting. Having that kind of frame leaves a lot of possibilities for complex discussions of the book, inside the book. By chance, I am reading "S." right now, which does the same. There is a main book (Ship of Theseus), but in the margen are scribbled lots of notes by two college students, discussing the book as you read it. It's really challenging to keep all the layers of story straight, but very intriguing as well.
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Offline night_wrtr

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #35 on: September 16, 2016, 02:02:31 PM »
Direct utility of inserted poetry in a work is questionable given the number of people who hate it. But then, lovers of poetry tend, in my experience, to be reticent and soft-spoken. So maybe, for every loud hater, there are several silent "meh" reactions, and who knows how many "Love this!" reactions.

Indirect utility of poetry in the crafting of a work can be substantial - provided the writer wants to craft lyrical lines with some subtle uses of rhythm and tone. There is only a very, very fine line between some of the more sophisticated and nuanced writing schemes and poetry.


Consonance, alliteration, etc., are not stumbled upon by the writer as naturally-occurring accidents very often. And their impacts, especially in areas where the reader's attention is elsewhere, can be powerful. In short, empowering a violent, action scene can often be accomplished with some attention to the principles of meter and tone.
"She should not die, so fair, so desperate! At least she should not die alone, unaided." (Merry's encounter with the Witch King on the Fields of the Pelennor) - Surely some see several uses of "s"?

Consider this passage from the encounter with the Balrog in the Fellowship of the Ring.
"From out of the shadow a red sword leaped flaming.
Glamdring glittered white in answer.
There was a ringing clash and a stab of white fire. The Balrog fell back and its sword flew up in molten fragments. The wizard swayed on the bridge, stepped back a pace, and then again stood still."

The words are simple, the scene, dramatic - but there's more at work here.
Now consider it again, with my marks for stress (underlined) and alliteration:
Spoiler for Hiden:
"From out of the shadow a red sword leaped flaming.
Glamdring glittered white in answer.
There was a ringing clash and a stab of white fire. The Balrog fell back and its sword flew up in molten fragments. The wizard swayed on the bridge, stepped back a pace, and then again stood still."

It sounds like poetry, it reads like poetry, because it IS poetry. Tolkein loved Iambic meter, as evidenced by the Lays of Beleriand.

I contend that the rhythms of poetry are there, and empower these simple words to a level they could not achieve without those rhythms.

Consider the passage again from a phonic standpoint, attending to specific sounds:
Spoiler for Hiden:
"From out of the shadow a red sword leaped flaming.
Glamdring glittered white in answer.
There was a ringing clash and a stab of white fire. The Balrog fell back and its sword flew up in molten fragments. The wizard swayed on the bridge, stepped back a pace, and then again stood still."

The F's and L's dance across the hiss of the S's and the few C's with S-sounds. And why?

Spoiler for Hiden:
Because he's setting us up for his amazing line: "Fly you fools!"

The point being, there's a lot of uses of poetry, both obvious, and less so. And all are worth our time. My two cents.
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Offline The Gem Cutter

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Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #36 on: September 16, 2016, 04:54:50 PM »
@night_wrtr I don't know the reference behind the pic...
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Offline night_wrtr

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #37 on: September 16, 2016, 05:24:45 PM »
@night_wrtr I don't know the reference behind the pic...

Ah sorry. Just my confused reaction to your expert analysis! ;D I read your post a few times and I am still trying to connect everything. Trying to compute! I see what you're saying, but understand it not, do I.

I have never been good at poetic or lyrical analysis.

Offline The Gem Cutter

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Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #38 on: September 16, 2016, 05:28:02 PM »
You can force a story to follow rhythmic lines, if you have the foresight to think of it in time.

The ways in which you do this, vary with the times. To blur the lines between them, eliminate the rhymes.

You will find that stories are often best described as rhythmic, rhyme-less poems, that move the heart not through the eyes - but through the ear, instead.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2016, 05:32:59 PM by The_Gem_Cutter »
The Gem Cutter
"Each time, there is the same problem: do I dare? And then if you do dare, the dangers are there, and the help also, and the fulfillment or the fiasco. There's always the possibility of a fiasco. But there's also the possibility of bliss." - Joseph Campbell

Offline Kitvaria Sarene

Re: I hate poetry
« Reply #39 on: September 22, 2016, 09:27:55 PM »
You are not alone - I usually just skip them while reading too.
When listening to an audio book it will annoy me quite a bit to actually have to stick them out - or fear forwarding to far, and having to go back and fort, and loose even more time ;)

I agree with others before - I love the songs in Hobbit - but someone has to actually sing them. As words on paper I'd rather have an ongoing story...