November 12, 2019, 04:35:49 AM

Author Topic: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread  (Read 33150 times)

Offline The Gem Cutter

  • Captain Analogy
  • Writing Group
  • Khaleesi
  • *
  • Posts: 2960
  • Total likes: 2437
  • Gender: Male
  • We've exhausted all possibilities - time to begin.
    • View Profile
    • The Gem Cutter Tales
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #90 on: September 10, 2016, 07:10:03 AM »
Git 'er done!
The Gem Cutter
"Each time, there is the same problem: do I dare? And then if you do dare, the dangers are there, and the help also, and the fulfillment or the fiasco. There's always the possibility of a fiasco. But there's also the possibility of bliss." - Joseph Campbell

Offline night_wrtr

Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #91 on: September 11, 2016, 08:28:22 PM »
Still haven't had any inspiration. Harrrumphfff.

Offline Lanko

  • Sherlanko Holmes, Jiin Wei and Writing Contest Regular
  • Writing Group
  • Khaleesi
  • *
  • Posts: 2875
  • Total likes: 1966
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Lanko's Goodreads
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #92 on: September 11, 2016, 11:16:42 PM »
I think I just got my idea from a crazy dream. Wrote it down mostly as notes of what happened and I will see if I can pull it off.
Slow and steady wins the race.

Lanko's Year in Books 2019

Offline JMack

  • Hircum Magna Rex of the Fabled Atku Temple, and writing contest regular
  • Writing Group
  • Ringbearer
  • *****
  • Posts: 6977
  • Total likes: 4750
  • Gender: Male
  • Our daily efforts are love poems to the universe.
    • View Profile
    • Tales of Starlit Lands
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #93 on: September 12, 2016, 01:35:21 AM »
I've been working on an idea that has decided to get bigger and bigger and bigger, and then to link up to the second story I ever wrote for the Forum. And now, do I write omni? 3rd person POV for character A, then switch to character B (the real main character)? Or just stick with B throughout (which has its own problems).

Ahhh. The terrible trials of authorship.  ::)
Change, when it comes, will step lightly before it kicks like thunder. (GRMatthews)
You are being naive if you think that any sweet and light theme cannot be strangled and force fed it's own flesh. (Nora)
www.starlit-lands.com

Offline JMack

  • Hircum Magna Rex of the Fabled Atku Temple, and writing contest regular
  • Writing Group
  • Ringbearer
  • *****
  • Posts: 6977
  • Total likes: 4750
  • Gender: Male
  • Our daily efforts are love poems to the universe.
    • View Profile
    • Tales of Starlit Lands
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #94 on: September 12, 2016, 02:06:40 PM »
double-post.

Third time's the charm. Third-person limited POV with my main character.
Present tense.
Now we're cookin'.
Change, when it comes, will step lightly before it kicks like thunder. (GRMatthews)
You are being naive if you think that any sweet and light theme cannot be strangled and force fed it's own flesh. (Nora)
www.starlit-lands.com

Offline The Gem Cutter

  • Captain Analogy
  • Writing Group
  • Khaleesi
  • *
  • Posts: 2960
  • Total likes: 2437
  • Gender: Male
  • We've exhausted all possibilities - time to begin.
    • View Profile
    • The Gem Cutter Tales
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #95 on: September 12, 2016, 02:49:44 PM »
Present tense? Better you than me!
The Gem Cutter
"Each time, there is the same problem: do I dare? And then if you do dare, the dangers are there, and the help also, and the fulfillment or the fiasco. There's always the possibility of a fiasco. But there's also the possibility of bliss." - Joseph Campbell

Offline Nora

  • Dropped in from another planet avec son sourire provocateur - et Hades and Writing Contest Regular
  • Writing Group
  • Dragonrider
  • ***
  • Posts: 4584
  • Total likes: 3529
  • Gender: Female
  • The Explorer
    • View Profile
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #96 on: September 12, 2016, 04:21:49 PM »
Yay, two present tense stories, ftw. Let's change people's mind with our undiluted talent Jmack  ;D
"She will need coffee soon, or molecular degeneration will set in. Her French phrasing will take over even more strongly, and soon she will dissolve into a puddle of alienation and Kierkegaardian despair."  ~ Jmack

Wishy washy lyricism and maudlin unrequited love are my specialty - so said Lady_Ty

Offline JMack

  • Hircum Magna Rex of the Fabled Atku Temple, and writing contest regular
  • Writing Group
  • Ringbearer
  • *****
  • Posts: 6977
  • Total likes: 4750
  • Gender: Male
  • Our daily efforts are love poems to the universe.
    • View Profile
    • Tales of Starlit Lands
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #97 on: September 12, 2016, 05:24:58 PM »
Yrg.
1,694 words so far, and 25% of the story left to go.
 >:(
Change, when it comes, will step lightly before it kicks like thunder. (GRMatthews)
You are being naive if you think that any sweet and light theme cannot be strangled and force fed it's own flesh. (Nora)
www.starlit-lands.com

Offline m3mnoch

Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #98 on: September 12, 2016, 05:54:48 PM »
you guys are awesome.  i hope one day to dare to write in the first person.  but present tense?  that's well beyond my reach.

Offline Nora

  • Dropped in from another planet avec son sourire provocateur - et Hades and Writing Contest Regular
  • Writing Group
  • Dragonrider
  • ***
  • Posts: 4584
  • Total likes: 3529
  • Gender: Female
  • The Explorer
    • View Profile
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #99 on: September 12, 2016, 05:57:06 PM »
Don't see it as much more complicated than the past tense though? is it so mystical?
"She will need coffee soon, or molecular degeneration will set in. Her French phrasing will take over even more strongly, and soon she will dissolve into a puddle of alienation and Kierkegaardian despair."  ~ Jmack

Wishy washy lyricism and maudlin unrequited love are my specialty - so said Lady_Ty

Offline JMack

  • Hircum Magna Rex of the Fabled Atku Temple, and writing contest regular
  • Writing Group
  • Ringbearer
  • *****
  • Posts: 6977
  • Total likes: 4750
  • Gender: Male
  • Our daily efforts are love poems to the universe.
    • View Profile
    • Tales of Starlit Lands
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #100 on: September 12, 2016, 06:09:27 PM »
Read City of Stairs.
Awesome story, awesome present tense.
Change, when it comes, will step lightly before it kicks like thunder. (GRMatthews)
You are being naive if you think that any sweet and light theme cannot be strangled and force fed it's own flesh. (Nora)
www.starlit-lands.com

Offline The Gem Cutter

  • Captain Analogy
  • Writing Group
  • Khaleesi
  • *
  • Posts: 2960
  • Total likes: 2437
  • Gender: Male
  • We've exhausted all possibilities - time to begin.
    • View Profile
    • The Gem Cutter Tales
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #101 on: September 12, 2016, 06:15:54 PM »
Only indirectly, and mostly in long fiction.

Technical issues with Present relate to its limited tense-forms in English (something like 4 out of the 12), the lions share of which are in past tense forms. That in turn limits the writer's ability to present complex time relationships in simple language constructs (relating to sequencing of things, causal relationships,

Storytelling issues relate to constraining the writer's ability to foreshadow or to link past events to the present, the present to the future, and the past to the future in straightforward sentences - using conventions the writer and the audience are familiar with. It can certainly be done, but that lack of familiarity undermines things. Present tense also does not lend itself to developing suspense in conventional ways (although unconventional ways probably exist waiting to be discovered).

There are other issues with it relating to audiences: its feel is not unlike an amateur, live video - live and immediate, but not deliberate or subtle. Much of this is probably due to the way it influences writers (not unlike first person), tending to make them include asides and irrelevant details because they are a natural part of the flow, but not a welcome part of the story, if that makes sense.

People have been tinkering with it since the late 80s, so it's nothing new. I attribute its lack of popularity to its limiting of the writer's options, especially when stories are becoming more and more complex.
The Gem Cutter
"Each time, there is the same problem: do I dare? And then if you do dare, the dangers are there, and the help also, and the fulfillment or the fiasco. There's always the possibility of a fiasco. But there's also the possibility of bliss." - Joseph Campbell

Offline m3mnoch

Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #102 on: September 12, 2016, 06:29:09 PM »
uh . . . what he said. ^^^

Offline Nora

  • Dropped in from another planet avec son sourire provocateur - et Hades and Writing Contest Regular
  • Writing Group
  • Dragonrider
  • ***
  • Posts: 4584
  • Total likes: 3529
  • Gender: Female
  • The Explorer
    • View Profile
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #103 on: September 12, 2016, 06:41:08 PM »
Well then you definitely need to read City of Stairs, City of Blades, and American Elsewhere, because Bennett crafts incredibly complex plots, foreshadows like a true master, and conjures great images and feelings. I think the stories become totally engrossing thanks to the well mastered present tense that allow us to really discover the story as it flows. He's great at making recollections and informative paragraphs without the past tense intruding. To be honest, when reading City of Stairs, I almost realised half way into it that it was present tense. It didn't strike me properly.

I think the tense might be harder, but I don't get that video comparison. Every video seen for the first time has a "live" quality to it. The one type of video that feels past tense, besides w&b, would be camera surveillance footages!
Seriously, I think past tense is the most common, and hence the most accepted, but not necessarily always the best. It depends on the story you want to tell, and should be used only if it fits!
"She will need coffee soon, or molecular degeneration will set in. Her French phrasing will take over even more strongly, and soon she will dissolve into a puddle of alienation and Kierkegaardian despair."  ~ Jmack

Wishy washy lyricism and maudlin unrequited love are my specialty - so said Lady_Ty

Offline The Gem Cutter

  • Captain Analogy
  • Writing Group
  • Khaleesi
  • *
  • Posts: 2960
  • Total likes: 2437
  • Gender: Male
  • We've exhausted all possibilities - time to begin.
    • View Profile
    • The Gem Cutter Tales
Re: [Sep 2016] - Pirates! - Discussion Thread
« Reply #104 on: September 12, 2016, 06:49:00 PM »
When I say live quality, it has nothing to do with whether the video is new to the audience - I mean the inclusions of things that are not useful, inefficient use of the visual space, jerking of the camera - all the things that are edited out from non-live videos. It's just a feel, a comparison.

And interestingly, the use of "live video" styles in film (Blair Witch Project and some few others) is approximately the same as the number of successful, popular books in present tense - a very small minority.

Of course, if you want to be famous/successful, that's where you should work, as you love it and would be much more noticeable to fans of the tense and its strengths. Not everyone can do it, clearly, and if you can, well that's a super-power you can fight crime with.
The Gem Cutter
"Each time, there is the same problem: do I dare? And then if you do dare, the dangers are there, and the help also, and the fulfillment or the fiasco. There's always the possibility of a fiasco. But there's also the possibility of bliss." - Joseph Campbell