April 10, 2021, 04:21:59 PM

Author Topic: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3  (Read 13896 times)

Offline Arry

  • Cat of the Canals
  • Administrator
  • Elderling
  • ***
  • Posts: 5887
  • Gender: Female
  • Faceless
    • Tenacious Reader
Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« on: January 12, 2014, 07:59:05 PM »
Alright, quick recap of Book Two, I didn't have much time, so Book Three is shorter. Feel free to mention any events I missed, I am sure there are plenty. :)

Book Two - set in Darujhistan

We hear his about Kruppe's dream where he travels to an inn inhabited by beggars. They claim at different times to perhaps be his Virtues, Doubts, Gifts, Hunger, Humility

Quote
You are Humility but, as everyone knows, Humility has no place in Kruppe’s life, remember that. So here you will stay.”

Erikson, Steven (2004-06-01). Gardens of the Moon: Book One of The Malazan Book of the Fallen (p. 137). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.
Quote
Within the walls of his skull rang the dirge of prophecy, and it echoed through his bones.

Erikson, Steven (2004-06-01). Gardens of the Moon: Book One of The Malazan Book of the Fallen (p. 134). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.
There is also reference to the spinning coin and the youth it falls before.

Crokus breaks into a beautiful young lady's rooms to steal the plethora of gifts that have been given to her by suitors. He stole a bounty, but was also enamored of her while she slept. Topless. On his way back, he happens to seen by an assassin who was just attacked (by another assassin). The injured assassin mistakes him Crokus as his assailant and tries to shoot him. A coin falls seemingly out of nowhere and Crokus he picks it up (and narrowly misses the assassins bolt because of it). The injured assassin is finished off, and the two killers catch sight of Crokus. He is chased but manages to find refuge.


Crone is sent to Darujhistan by Rake to see out Baruk (a sorcerer/high alchemist). While Crone is meeting with Baruk, Orr stops by, she disguises herself as a dog to him, and she listens while Baruk and Orr speak. Baruk is secretly the head of all the mages. Orr wants Baruk to use his influence the citys mages's agree to a proclamation of neutrality. He also tells Baruk that Pale's mages were assassinated by a Claw. Baruk states this does not match what he knows and does not agree to help Orr. Rake show up, tells Baruk that the mages had fled Pale and that he wants their heads. Baruk agrees to give them to him because he thinks it will be less cruel than what Rake would do to them himself if he handed them over live.

Rollick Nom (an assassin) kilos Councilman Lim while he is with Lady Simtal. Lady Simtal is also having an affair with Orr, when she meets with him, she asks him to arrange for Coll to be assassinated. (Coll is the one who is always passed out drunk when Crokus meets with the group: Crokus, Coll, Kruppe, Murillio, Rallick)

Rallick warns Crokus to stay away from the Orr estate. Crokus also asks Kruppe for the items he stole earlier back. Rallick and Murillio decide later to try to steer Crokus away from thieving to give him a chance at a better life. Kruppe knows that Crokus is in possession of Oponn's coin, tells Baruk. They must protect him … until they don't. Or something like that.

Book Three

Quick Ben tries to bring Hairlock back from the warren. Hairlock seems to be growing more crazy from meddling with Chaos. He also says that a god must have interfered for Paran to have been able to wound the Hound.

Toc shows up in time to save Lorn from an attack of Barghast. The rest of her group was killed.

Paran tells Tattersail that a god intervened to save him.

Lorn and Toc get to Pale. She meets with Dujek and he tells her of the numerous attempts on his life. Tayschrenn has ordered a disturbing number of the nobility be purged. Dujek is obviously not happy with this.

At dinner, we find out that Lorn was in the Mouse Quarter (and lost everything) when it was cleansed. And that Tattersail was one of the mages involved.

While Paran and Lorn talk, he tells her that Sorry is possessed by The Rope, The Patron of Assassins, Shadowthrone's companion.

Tattersail travels, meets Bellurdan (still carrying his lovers remains still in a sack). She determines that Lorn is supposed to unleash the Jaghut, Bellurdan says he thinks the mission is to prevent that. To be safe, they fight and Tattersail burns them both to a crisp by opening her warren. Tattersail attempts a quick spell to save herself.


Quote
“Tell me, Tool, what dominates your thoughts?” The Imass shrugged before replying. “I think of futility, Adjunct.” “Do all Imass think about futility?” “No. Few think at all.” “Why is that?” The Imass leaned his head to one side and regarded her. “Because, Adjunct, it is futile.”

Erikson, Steven (2004-06-01). Gardens of the Moon: Book One of The Malazan Book of the Fallen (p. 248). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies. The man who never reads lives only once.”
-- George R.R. Martin

http://www.tenaciousreader.com

http://www.speculativeherald.com

Offline Arry

  • Cat of the Canals
  • Administrator
  • Elderling
  • ***
  • Posts: 5887
  • Gender: Female
  • Faceless
    • Tenacious Reader
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2014, 08:00:57 PM »
A little bit of my reaction to both books:

Interesting how Crokus is in the middle of all these key players. It is a bit of a strange crew, you have to wonder how they all fell in together. And assassin (Rollick - who killed Councilman Lim), a mage (Kruppe - who is connected with Baruk), a dandy (who will likely end up another of Lady Simtal's lovers. Also involved with the Guild and Rallick), a young thief in the middle of it all.

Also curious what has truly happened to Tattersail, how she will reemerge.

I'm not really all that crazy about Crone. Can't say why exactly.

Also when Paran was talking to Toc about Tattersail's death

Quote
Only she didn’t die easily, she never took the easy path in anything.

Erikson, Steven (2004-06-01). Gardens of the Moon: Book One of The Malazan Book of the Fallen (p. 244). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition.

I couldn't help but think how quickly he can judge how Tattersail would always/normally act do they really know each other that well? have they had the time or chance? Kind of a petty reaction on my part, but couldn't help it.

There's a ton going on here. The Guild war/civil war, spies, assassins, plots, gods, etc. etc. It's hard to know where to even start with comments.

ETA: Kruppe speaking of himself in 3rd person is bit annoying. I keep thinking he's the Jar Jar Binks of GotM.

But, I am really enjoying the book. So far still intrigued instead of confused. :)
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 01:12:18 AM by Arry »
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies. The man who never reads lives only once.”
-- George R.R. Martin

http://www.tenaciousreader.com

http://www.speculativeherald.com

Offline Evazorek

  • Shadow Op
  • ****
  • Posts: 61
  • Gender: Male
  • Quest designer and writer
    • My writing blog.
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2014, 07:32:12 AM »
I think this is the part of the book where I started having to really focus on each section to work out who was involved and why. A lot of the second book seemed to be setting up characters and situations for later on when everyone arrives at Darujhistan.

The introduction of, "Tool," and his tales were what really interested me. Now what I didn't get here is how nonchalantly the introduction of a member of an ancient and powerful race was introduced here. In the description he is a huge lumbering sort of skeleton lord. He is full of wisdom and his power is clearly great, yet he just seems to show up and act as escort for Lorn. It all seemed a little out of the blue for me.

I really enjoyed their discussions on the road though.

Also the fight Tattersail has was really good and I was genuinely sad when she, "Died."
Writing Blog: www.rhodestonowhere.com
Online Portfolio: www.sterhodes.com

Offline eclipse

  • Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 120 days.
  • Elderling
  • ****
  • Posts: 5171
  • Gender: Male
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2014, 05:23:44 PM »
Only read book two, I slowed down on purpose didn't want to finish the novel too fast 

The first time we meet Kruppe I had to re-read the chapter again I eventually got used to his speech now and his odd dreams

The Crokus episode where he flees from the assassins was exciting and the misunderstanding where another assassin thought the thief was an assassin was well done

Rake's sword a tiny bit scary isn't it  :)

Who do you think the Eel is?  Kruppe too obvious to be the Eel maybe Coil not seen much of him and being drunk would be a good disguise  could be anyone
« Last Edit: January 14, 2014, 05:11:27 PM by Eclipse »
According to some,* heroic deaths are admirable things

* Generally those who don't have to do it.Politicians and writers spring to mind

Jonathan Stroud:Ptolmy's Gate

ACSmyth

  • Guest
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2014, 03:02:20 PM »
I'm into book 3. Still hanging in there. I need to decide at the end of this whether to buy the second part, since the audio book is sold in two parts. I hate it when they do that, but *shrugs*.

Offline Arry

  • Cat of the Canals
  • Administrator
  • Elderling
  • ***
  • Posts: 5887
  • Gender: Female
  • Faceless
    • Tenacious Reader
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2014, 04:37:48 PM »
I'm into book 3. Still hanging in there. I need to decide at the end of this whether to buy the second part, since the audio book is sold in two parts. I hate it when they do that, but *shrugs*.

That would be really annoying! I've never seen that with my audiobooks. I guess it makes the books half price, maybe it could be useful if you decide you don't like the book or narrator.

The introduction of, "Tool," and his tales were what really interested me. Now what I didn't get here is how nonchalantly the introduction of a member of an ancient and powerful race was introduced here. In the description he is a huge lumbering sort of skeleton lord. He is full of wisdom and his power is clearly great, yet he just seems to show up and act as escort for Lorn. It all seemed a little out of the blue for me.
Ooops, think I forgot much of Tool when I was trying to write my recap. I actually liked the introduction. It was a bit strange and mysterious, but I'd rather have that than some big  infodump on who and what he is.

Who do you think the Eel is?  Kruppe too obvious to be the Eel maybe Coil not seen much of him and being drunk would be a good disguise  could be anyone

Yeah, I don't reallly think it's Coll, but that certainly would be an interesting turn of events. He could probably hear all sorts of things while people assume he is passed out drunk.

I've actually just assumed the Eel is yet another character yet to be introduced, but having it be an existing character could certainly be the case. I'll have to think on that more as I read :)
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies. The man who never reads lives only once.”
-- George R.R. Martin

http://www.tenaciousreader.com

http://www.speculativeherald.com

Offline Dessembrae

  • Coreling
  • ***
  • Posts: 37
  • Gender: Male
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2014, 07:05:51 PM »

 That's the attitude it takes to enjoy Malazan. Throughout the story you'll learn all about Onos T'oolan and the T'lan Imass, and loads of other races too.

Offline Justan Henner

  • Barbarian who pronounces are, our and hour all the same way
  • Writing Group
  • Auror
  • ***
  • Posts: 1071
  • Gender: Male
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2014, 07:35:07 PM »


The introduction of, "Tool," and his tales were what really interested me. Now what I didn't get here is how nonchalantly the introduction of a member of an ancient and powerful race was introduced here. In the description he is a huge lumbering sort of skeleton lord. He is full of wisdom and his power is clearly great, yet he just seems to show up and act as escort for Lorn. It all seemed a little out of the blue for me.
Ooops, think I forgot much of Tool when I was trying to write my recap. I actually liked the introduction. It was a bit strange and mysterious, but I'd rather have that than some big  infodump on who and what he is.


I agree. I'd much rather read a character's backstory and description in pieces than one long info dump. It makes it better to see it in parts because that way you see different parts from different perspectives. Some factions fear the T'lan Imass, others respect them, others revere them, and it all depends on the character. A big info dump cheapens that, because it gives authority to the PoV which provides the info, and makes you more likely to believe their perspective than that of someone else down the line.

Offline eclipse

  • Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 120 days.
  • Elderling
  • ****
  • Posts: 5171
  • Gender: Male
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2014, 09:47:57 PM »
Finished Book 3

Ok Has Tattersail body swapped with Nightchill?

I'm really like reading about Toc the younger and Hairlock

Dujek burning the books so Tayschrenn didnt get the name of all the Pale nobles to execute and Dujek stopping Lorn from executing Tattersail I enjoyed those scenes

I'm getting confused with all the different names for the warrens but i do enjoy reading about them I find them very intriguing
« Last Edit: January 15, 2014, 09:54:41 PM by Eclipse »
According to some,* heroic deaths are admirable things

* Generally those who don't have to do it.Politicians and writers spring to mind

Jonathan Stroud:Ptolmy's Gate

Offline Arry

  • Cat of the Canals
  • Administrator
  • Elderling
  • ***
  • Posts: 5887
  • Gender: Female
  • Faceless
    • Tenacious Reader
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2014, 03:22:44 PM »
Finished Book 3

Ok Has Tattersail body swapped with Nightchill?
Trying to remember exactly where Book 3 stopped. Pretty sure at this point, you don't know exactly what happened, but that she made an attempt to save herself through some use of magic and Nightchill's remains.

Quote
I'm really like reading about Toc the younger and Hairlock
Honestly, I'm not sure why more books don't feature possessed puppets/marionettes.

Quote
Dujek burning the books so Tayschrenn didnt get the name of all the Pale nobles to execute and Dujek stopping Lorn from executing Tattersail I enjoyed those scenes
Yes! I especially liked Dujek burning the books.

Quote
I'm getting confused with all the different names for the warrens but i do enjoy reading about them I find them very intriguing
I figure it will all start to come together and be easier to keep straight.It's harder to remember names when we have little context to associate with them. As we learn more, should become easier. I think. ;)
“A reader lives a thousand lives before he dies. The man who never reads lives only once.”
-- George R.R. Martin

http://www.tenaciousreader.com

http://www.speculativeherald.com

ACSmyth

  • Guest
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2014, 04:11:19 PM »
I think I'm out.

I'm about 40 minutes from the end of the part I've bought (which was about 13 hours). This close to the end I'd usually plough on through, but I'm finding even when I'm cleaning or cooking, I'm not picking up my mp3 player. Normally it's pretty automatic, but it's become a bit of a chore. I've followed the story OK, but I'm not really interested in any of the characters.

I've read The Lions of Al-Rassan quite recently, so I'll pass on that, but I'll keep an eye out for what's chosen for March.

Offline Dessembrae

  • Coreling
  • ***
  • Posts: 37
  • Gender: Male
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2014, 06:42:53 PM »
I think I'm out.

I'm about 40 minutes from the end of the part I've bought (which was about 13 hours). This close to the end I'd usually plough on through, but I'm finding even when I'm cleaning or cooking, I'm not picking up my mp3 player. Normally it's pretty automatic, but it's become a bit of a chore. I've followed the story OK, but I'm not really interested in any of the characters.

I've read The Lions of Al-Rassan quite recently, so I'll pass on that, but I'll keep an eye out for what's chosen for March.

 I felt the same way about GoTM. I didn't care what happened to any of the characters. Erikson's characterization improves in a big way over the next couple of books. Book 3 Memories of ice is an all time favorite, it's worth sticking it out IMO.

ACSmyth

  • Guest
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2014, 07:15:55 PM »
I felt the same way about GoTM. I didn't care what happened to any of the characters. Erikson's characterization improves in a big way over the next couple of books. Book 3 Memories of ice is an all time favorite, it's worth sticking it out IMO.

This is what I don't get. As writers, we're told we've got to have hooked the reader in the first chapter. But I've got to wait till book 3? What happened there?

Maybe I'll go back sometime, but I've got a ton of other stuff I'd rather read right now. My TBR pile is close to being declared unsafe.

Offline eclipse

  • Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 120 days.
  • Elderling
  • ****
  • Posts: 5171
  • Gender: Male
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2014, 11:24:16 AM »
I seem to have overshot and read book 4 .... I've really got into the story need to slow down
According to some,* heroic deaths are admirable things

* Generally those who don't have to do it.Politicians and writers spring to mind

Jonathan Stroud:Ptolmy's Gate

Offline simonster

  • Ambient Mage
  • ****
  • Posts: 414
Re: Week 2: Book Two and Book 3
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2014, 10:39:32 AM »
This is what I don't get. As writers, we're told we've got to have hooked the reader in the first chapter. But I've got to wait till book 3? What happened there?

This puzzles me too.  I'm not a writer, but it felt to me like GotM was still at least one round of revisions away from being ready to meet its audience.  Is there a story behind how the book came to be published?

(Context:  I read the book a few years ago; I'm not reading along with the Book Club.  Overall I was sort of impressed by it - but I also felt there was a lot wrong with it.  It's unlikely I'll ever read the other books in the series.)